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<blockquote data-quote="Klaudius Rex" data-source="post: 6945662" data-attributes="member: 6807408">Good points.I am not at all going to touch or otherwise Nerf the rogue class. it should stand on its own, as is.I will probably change a few monsters perception scores, or give them advantage especially, if in their lairs or other familiar territory. The big thing that i got out of this is to make sure to account for all players actions (Standard, Move, Bonus if any). I actually talked to my player who played the rogue this weekend. He completely understood that simply moving behind cover doesn't automatically equate to &quot;hiding&quot;. It just means cover. Monsters don't need a perception check to find the rogue because in combat, its assumed that everyone is watching out for their lives, and they just saw the rogue take cover (if intelligent enough, of course).Essentially, it boils down to Hiding/Stealth skills are still actions.&nbsp; WotC kept the idea of actions around from 4th edition, which makes sense in combat. They are not free actions. The rogue is blessed with Cunning Action to get be able to Hide as a bonus action (which makes me wonder if other classes need to take their Action just to hide?). If a rogue legitimately takes whatever action to hide, then he is hidden (based on his stealth skill) from whoever cannot see him (monsters perception).&nbsp;...I just gave him the Cloak of Elvenkind.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Klaudius Rex, post: 6945662, member: 6807408"] Good points. I am not at all going to touch or otherwise Nerf the rogue class. it should stand on its own, as is. I will probably change a few monsters perception scores, or give them advantage especially, if in their lairs or other familiar territory. The big thing that i got out of this is to make sure to account for all players actions (Standard, Move, Bonus if any). I actually talked to my player who played the rogue this weekend. He completely understood that simply moving behind cover doesn't automatically equate to "hiding". It just means cover. Monsters don't need a perception check to find the rogue because in combat, its assumed that everyone is watching out for their lives, and they just saw the rogue take cover (if intelligent enough, of course). Essentially, it boils down to Hiding/Stealth skills are still actions. WotC kept the idea of actions around from 4th edition, which makes sense in combat. They are not free actions. The rogue is blessed with Cunning Action to get be able to Hide as a bonus action (which makes me wonder if other classes need to take their Action just to hide?). If a rogue legitimately takes whatever action to hide, then he is hidden (based on his stealth skill) from whoever cannot see him (monsters perception). ...I just gave him the Cloak of Elvenkind. [/QUOTE]

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