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Message: <blockquote data-quote="ThePolarBear" data-source="post: 6947307" data-attributes="member: 6857451">Numbers added for clarity.1) Yes, you do not give away your position until you have attacked. But only if you are still hidden before the attack. If you are seen before the attack you lose your "hidden" status immediatly. Before the attack.That's why there's a big difference between theater of the mind and grid. TotM : A player might say "i just lean out of cover with my bow and fire". This, if the DM allows, would be perfectly fine as an example of "shooting from cover" from point 2. You still have cover, just no longer total cover. You still are not "clearly visible" and can stay hidden. On a  grid this thing is not possible if your cover gives total cover to your target too. You have to move out of cover,possibly blowing your "cover" (terrible puns are terrible) and be seen. No hiding bonus. You might play around the grid and see if there's a place where you could have 3/4 cover and LOS or whatever. You just can't step out in the open and make an attack while retaining the bonus.2) You are not directly targettable and people have to assume where you are. If combat is not already ongoing as fjw70 said you might have the benefit of surprising your foes. If it's already ongoing and cover is big enough or there are zones of darkness around, you might be able to get away. If there's only a pillar or something you still have all the advantages of being hidden... the place is just not the best for hiding, so prehaps your action might be spent in better ways than hiding. If you really want to hide do not be surprised if someone comes round the corner on their turn and see that you are actually still there since there's no other place to run to. Instead of hiding you might have drunk a potion.3) The baseline is RAW. Not always the strongest baseline ever, i'll admit. Yeah, i'm looking at you Freedom of Movement. Usually in this discussions at least one side talks about RAI. And best RAI is what works for your table, even if that is going backwards on what RAW tells you to do. This is expecially true on hiding, where the rules are actually MEANT to be left in the air. We can discuss all the time on the parts that are RAW, but even RAW has a limit. See the requirement for hiding having been changed from "not seen" to "not seen clearly". What the freckles does "clearly" even mean? Before it was clear cut. Now it's wishy washy DM stuff. We can discuss how the first point of Skulker gets invalidated if your master allows to hide in dim light since "you can't be seen clearly", or how heavy rain allows a human to hide in spite of Wood Elves racials since the DM says "you can't be seen clearly". Point is... that is the rule. And that's why i have to try and check all my posts on the subjects for any "might" that i might have missed, since there's always going to be a corner case.</blockquote>

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