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Message: <blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 6960646" data-attributes="member: 42582">But an ordinary person in heavier snow can't hide either, can s/he, if actually under observation from the person s/he is hoping to hide from?Trying to put a few things together:You can’t hide from a creature that can see you clearly . . . (Basic PDF p 60) While traveling at a slow pace, the characters can move stealthily. As long as they’re not in the open, they can try to surprise or sneak by other creatures they encounter. See the rules for hiding in chapter 7. (Basic PDF p 64) A heavily obscured area - such as darkness, opaque fog, or dense foliage - blocks vision entirely . . . (Basic PDF p 65) Mask of the Wild. You can attempt to hide even when you are only lightly obscured by foliage, heavy rain, falling snow, mist, and other natural phenomena. (Basic PDF p 15)The bit on p 64 is very reminiscent of the 4e Stealth rules, which allow remaining hidden provided there is cover or concealment (ie provided the character is not in the open).The bit on p 60 is somewhat reminiscent of the 4e Steath rules, which require total concealment or superior cover to become hidden. However, it has the adverb clearly.This might suggest that if a person is in heavy snow or fog, and is being seen - but not being seen clearly, because of the snow/fog - s/he can attempt to become hidden.However, the obscurement and elf rules don't seem to me to support this, at least as a matter of textual interpretation. The elf rule seem to imply that mask of the wild is a special ability, which means that light obscurement is not enough for an ordinary person to become hidden (otherwise, mask of the wild would be redundant). And the obscurement rules seem to imply that the only alternative to light obscurement is heavy obscurement, which blocks vision altogether.So on a purely textual basis, I can't see any scope for a situation in which a non-elfin person is in a snowstorm or fog, is able to be seen at all, yet is able to attempt to become hidden.Sticking to this textual basis for the rules, I am seeing two possibilities.One, which to me is close to classic D&D and JRRT, is that elves automatically "vanish" in the sort of natural phenomena that mask of the wild refers to. (An oddity is that they might vanish even to one another; though advantage on WIS checks to notice hidden creatures will help with this.)The other, which is (I think)  [MENTION=6787503]Hriston[/MENTION]'s view, is that elves don't automatically "vanish" in those natural phenomena, but can use them to hide provided they are not being observed. On this view, an elf can step out of his/her front door and into a non-blinding snowstorm and attempt to hide from anyone spying on the house - whereas an ordinary person who steps out of his/her front door into a snowstorm will automatically fail on any attempt to hide unless the snow is falling so thickly as to effectively blind those in it (ie provides heavy obscurement).</blockquote>

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