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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Hriston" data-source="post: 6965658" data-attributes="member: 6787503">But who would they be hiding from? In my example the patrol group comes into sighting range at 150 feet, which is still too far away to hear normal noise levels. They are already undetected and effectively hidden behind the hill without trying. The wood elf's attempt is to keep his location hidden when the patrol group actually has a chance of locating him. The human doesn't have that chance. She will be seen when the patrol comes within sighting distance.I agree. I'm not sure what you're arguing with here.</blockquote>