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Message: <blockquote data-quote="HeapThaumaturgist" data-source="post: 2408302" data-attributes="member: 12332">I just wanted to clarify my position a little:  I'm not saying that ForceUser is wrong or that his style of play 'needs' to change or anything of the sort.  If the whole group really gets into literary gaming and deep character, that's cool.  I'll illustrate a similar position in an anecdote, because I can't help but be a storyteller.My wife REALLY loves those kinds of games.  She doesn't like any other kind of game, at all.  Too much combat turns her off, combat at all in general she doesn't like unless she can role-play through it.  Her first gaming experiences were all with free-form "Role Play" games where the game was mostly a collaborative moment of story-telling and nobody had any rules.  They called it D&D, but they didn't have dice.  That's what she thought D&D WAS until she met me.  The groups we have to play here are mixed.  But, in total, nobody else where we are likes the same "no rules, all story" approach to gaming that my wife likes.  Some people like just the opposite.  All hacking, all day.  I, as a DM, try to cater to EVERYBODY.  The RP people get to RP, but I try to put combat into every session so the combat people get combat.  That's my GMing style.  Alot of people like it.  My wife doesn't.  If it's not all-story-all-day she gets bored and wanders off.  Literally.  Like she'll go get a coke and two hours later we find her in the kitchen reading a book standing at the counter.  Eventually we came to an agreement that HER style wouldn't work for everybody else ... nobody wanted to just talk in character for several hours and visualize combats without dice and minis.  And she couldn't keep focus on a game where people were measuring fireball radii and arguing about where one can and cannot take 5' Steps to.  So she doesn't game with us anymore.  But it's a solution we came to together.  She was amiable to not playing RPGs with us, she didn't feel butt-hurt about it or anything like that.  Our game-club here has loads of board-games and stuff, which she oddly DOES like, and on game-nights she goes into the other room and plays Settlers of Catan and whatnot while I play D&D.But here's the thing.  She's my wife.  I can't just "kick her out".  Had she been obstinant about wanting to play without dice and just couldn't deal with not being in the game, well, she's my WIFE.  Even if she were being juvenile or a "jerk" about the situation, I think most people can accept that, as my wife, I can't just tell her to shove off and that gaming is more important and everybody else at the table is as well.  Maybe some people would say:  "Dude, get a divorce, she's totally a beast." but, in the end, it would be my decision to quit gaming and find something else to do that my wife and I could do together.  Because that relationship is more important than gaming.SO ... what I'm SAYING is ... if there's no way to get rid of Bob because the work and friend relationships will be ruined by kicking him out, then the decision is not:  "Can Bob play the way we want him to play?" but "Is our game or our style of gaming worth more than the work and friend relationships that will be hurt by kicking him out."  THAT is what has to be addressed, in the final summation.  If the game is more important, then intestinal fortitude will need to be called on and Bob will have to be evicted.  If the relationships are more important, then the whole group needs to stop bellyaching about Bob and learn a compromise style of gaming.  OR if the relationships AND the style of gaming are too important to lose ... then the whole game needs to go.Bob, really, has become irrelevant.  Once it has been determined that Bob is going to be a known and finite quantity in the equation, then the other variables WILL HAVE TO BE changed around Bob.  Whether that makes him a jerk or the patron saint of mixed vegetable side dishes isn't part of the math.--fje</blockquote>

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