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<blockquote data-quote="Neonchameleon" data-source="post: 6315900" data-attributes="member: 87792">Agreed.&nbsp; And the fact that the first run&nbsp; through of Tomb of Horrors was 100% successful, no casualties, and all&nbsp; treasure obtained is just amusing.Equally adversarial was the&nbsp; Earseeker - a monster that lives in doors and burrows into peoples' ears&nbsp; - to deliberately stop them listening at doors (until they invented ear&nbsp; trumpets).What we would call metagaming, of course, was SOP in Lake Geneva.&nbsp;&nbsp; And in just about any form of D&amp;D where player skill is prized.I'm going to disagree with you about Fate there.&nbsp; There is very&nbsp; little in Fate I can't trace back to Fuge, Amber, or Risus, and that&nbsp; GURPS wasn't also doing in the 90s.&nbsp; (Fortune in the middle?&nbsp; Check -&nbsp; when you used ordinary luck.&nbsp; Social influence?&nbsp; Check.&nbsp; Ability to take&nbsp; over narrative with e.g. Super Luck?&nbsp; check.)&nbsp; And you don't get much more trad than GURPS.Once you remove the GMless games (e.g. Fiasco), the Old School/Modernist divide is much much smaller than the advocates on any side would make out in my experience.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Neonchameleon, post: 6315900, member: 87792"] Agreed. And the fact that the first run through of Tomb of Horrors was 100% successful, no casualties, and all treasure obtained is just amusing. Equally adversarial was the Earseeker - a monster that lives in doors and burrows into peoples' ears - to deliberately stop them listening at doors (until they invented ear trumpets). What we would call metagaming, of course, was SOP in Lake Geneva. And in just about any form of D&D where player skill is prized. I'm going to disagree with you about Fate there. There is very little in Fate I can't trace back to Fuge, Amber, or Risus, and that GURPS wasn't also doing in the 90s. (Fortune in the middle? Check - when you used ordinary luck. Social influence? Check. Ability to take over narrative with e.g. Super Luck? check.) And you don't get much more trad than GURPS. Once you remove the GMless games (e.g. Fiasco), the Old School/Modernist divide is much [I]much[/I] smaller than the advocates on any side would make out in my experience. [/QUOTE]

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