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DMing, Sandboxes, and Boring Dungeons. HELP
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<blockquote data-quote="Gargoyle" data-source="post: 6356243" data-attributes="member: 529"><p>Just a few pieces of advice which may have already been touched on, all IMO. I'm a big fan of sandbox campaigns.</p><p></p><p>1. Don't over prepare. Think about how far your group will get during an average session. Prepare for that, and maybe just a little more. In a good sandbox game they will get to make some decisions during the session, but you don't need the whole world mapped out, just a little more than what's over the horizon. Take that literally with regard to maps, but also metaphorically, with regard to how much you flesh out NPC's etc. If you prepare for more, it hurts your ability to improvise and adapt to the choices they make during the session. IMO you shouldn't design too far ahead, because the point of it is to customize the next session based on what they did this time.</p><p></p><p>2. Keep things moving. There is nothing worse than a DM sifting through notes or rules, or letting a player bog things down. It's better to get a rule wrong or make something up that is bad or cheesy than to spend 5 minutes looking for your perfectly written notes. This is just good advice for any type of campaign, but it's so good I couldn't leave it out.</p><p></p><p>3. There should be three plots for the party to pursue. These are major things associated with quests that they can choose to get involved in, or not. More than three is too much work for both the DM and players, but of course you may disagree and have more. Only two is more of a choose your own adventure campaign, which may be fine, but isn't exactly a sandbox, and only one is a railroad, which of course may also be fine (railroads get a bad rep, but everyone loves adventure paths? lol), but of course isn't a sandbox. These do not include small subplots, of which there should be as many as you feel like presenting. This may not be a "pure sandbox" but I think it's more practical, and since you can drop a plot and create new ones based on the player's interests, it's still very sandboxy. </p><p></p><p>4. Let the world suffer when a major plot isn't resolved. One thing about a good sandbox is that things happen even if the PC's don't get involved. Three major plots might be:</p><p></p><p>- rescuing a princess from a dragon</p><p>- defeating a necromancer's army of undead</p><p>- stopping a ritual from opening a portal to the outer realms</p><p></p><p>The party might want to pursue all of them, or just one or two. But if they ignore a plot, let the world feel it. Bad things should happen. </p><p></p><p>You can make it impossible to solve all these issue so that they have to let one evil plot succeed, but if they really make an effort to fight off the undead army before breakfast so they have time to save the princess, let them. The point of this is to gauge their interest. If I only present them with one path, they will trudge on and rescue the princess from the dragon. But if I present them with choices, (and you can be very overt about this, with bounty boards or even cards with quests on them if you wish, especially at the beginning of the game) they will let you know which ones they are interested in, so you know what to start fleshing out.</p><p></p><p>The death of the princess may result in her despondent father becoming mad and his evil adviser taking over and ruling with an iron fist, increasing taxes and raising the prices of everything and imprisoning anyone who speaks ill of him.</p><p></p><p>Not stopping the ritual could result in wandering monster encounters with aberrations that slither through the portal. </p><p></p><p>Not stopping the army of undead could result in a costly war, and result in plague and more encounters with undead.</p><p></p><p>This of course can present more plots for them to pursue, and when one is complete, you can create another one, preferably just before they wrap one up to give it an organic feel.</p><p></p><p>5. Make certain that the player characters have allies that are loyal, competent, and useful. They don't have to have any combat ability, it can be as simple as:</p><p></p><p>- a weaponsmith who does exceptional work</p><p>- a noble in the court or street urchin willing to impart valuable information</p><p>- a member of the city watch willing to look the other way or take their side in a dispute</p><p>- a farmer glad to shelter them</p><p>- an orphanage of kids that admire the adventurers</p><p>- an innkeeper who used to be an adventurer until he took an arrow to the knee</p><p></p><p>Just remember they need to be loyal, competent, and useful. Annoying NPC's aren't going to be cared about. </p><p></p><p>Throughout the campaign, keep these people safe and loyal. Don't use them as hostages or have them turn traitorous (you can do this with other NPCs, just decide ahead of time that these ones are reliable allies and resources). But don't hesitate to let the world harm them if a plot is ignored or failed. Having real friends will motivate the PC's to act like real heroes, or at least give them something to care about besides treasure and power. I think this is especially important in sandbox campaigns, since players are deciding the direction of the campaign. They often want to be heroic, but DM's don't give them the opportunity. Even mercenaries who don't care about these characters want the ability to express that, so the existence of these types of characters is good for everyone.</p><p></p><p>6. Be ready to drop (or change) your favorite stuff. If they don't express interest in a plot or a character, you have to stop pushing it and develop something else. You can always bring back that character or plot later, reskinning it to something they might be interested in. This point is why I say don't over prepare. If you spend hours detailing the town of Whateverville, only to see them yawn and decide to leave to go to Niftytown, you've wasted your time and made the game less fun for you. </p><p></p><p>One thing you can do is take the cool parts of Whateverville that they haven't seen yet, and plug them into Niftytown. If they haven't experienced it yet, you shouldn't throw it out, just move it. Same goes for NPCs. If they never meet Baron Somesuch because they never went to that part of the map, move him and rename him if you must. Just don't push something that the majority of your players clearly have no interest in, drop it, even if you liked it. Maybe you can use it in another campaign or later.</p><p></p><p>7. It's ok to railroad for a little while. Even in a sandbox, there are times when the party will be involved in a sequence of events that you've planned out. This is ok, as long as they seem to enjoy it, and as long as it's not too long and restrictive. I mention this because I think a lot of DM's get afraid of railroading, but hey, every now and then a good old fashioned dungeon crawl or a series of gauntlet style encounters can be fun. I especially think it's ok to throw in a published adventure in the middle of a sandbox campaign, treating it as just another plot that they can pursue, delay or abandon as they see fit. You could even do this with multiple planned adventures. After all, three railroads aren't really a railroad.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Gargoyle, post: 6356243, member: 529"] Just a few pieces of advice which may have already been touched on, all IMO. I'm a big fan of sandbox campaigns. 1. Don't over prepare. Think about how far your group will get during an average session. Prepare for that, and maybe just a little more. In a good sandbox game they will get to make some decisions during the session, but you don't need the whole world mapped out, just a little more than what's over the horizon. Take that literally with regard to maps, but also metaphorically, with regard to how much you flesh out NPC's etc. If you prepare for more, it hurts your ability to improvise and adapt to the choices they make during the session. IMO you shouldn't design too far ahead, because the point of it is to customize the next session based on what they did this time. 2. Keep things moving. There is nothing worse than a DM sifting through notes or rules, or letting a player bog things down. It's better to get a rule wrong or make something up that is bad or cheesy than to spend 5 minutes looking for your perfectly written notes. This is just good advice for any type of campaign, but it's so good I couldn't leave it out. 3. There should be three plots for the party to pursue. These are major things associated with quests that they can choose to get involved in, or not. More than three is too much work for both the DM and players, but of course you may disagree and have more. Only two is more of a choose your own adventure campaign, which may be fine, but isn't exactly a sandbox, and only one is a railroad, which of course may also be fine (railroads get a bad rep, but everyone loves adventure paths? lol), but of course isn't a sandbox. These do not include small subplots, of which there should be as many as you feel like presenting. This may not be a "pure sandbox" but I think it's more practical, and since you can drop a plot and create new ones based on the player's interests, it's still very sandboxy. 4. Let the world suffer when a major plot isn't resolved. One thing about a good sandbox is that things happen even if the PC's don't get involved. Three major plots might be: - rescuing a princess from a dragon - defeating a necromancer's army of undead - stopping a ritual from opening a portal to the outer realms The party might want to pursue all of them, or just one or two. But if they ignore a plot, let the world feel it. Bad things should happen. You can make it impossible to solve all these issue so that they have to let one evil plot succeed, but if they really make an effort to fight off the undead army before breakfast so they have time to save the princess, let them. The point of this is to gauge their interest. If I only present them with one path, they will trudge on and rescue the princess from the dragon. But if I present them with choices, (and you can be very overt about this, with bounty boards or even cards with quests on them if you wish, especially at the beginning of the game) they will let you know which ones they are interested in, so you know what to start fleshing out. The death of the princess may result in her despondent father becoming mad and his evil adviser taking over and ruling with an iron fist, increasing taxes and raising the prices of everything and imprisoning anyone who speaks ill of him. Not stopping the ritual could result in wandering monster encounters with aberrations that slither through the portal. Not stopping the army of undead could result in a costly war, and result in plague and more encounters with undead. This of course can present more plots for them to pursue, and when one is complete, you can create another one, preferably just before they wrap one up to give it an organic feel. 5. Make certain that the player characters have allies that are loyal, competent, and useful. They don't have to have any combat ability, it can be as simple as: - a weaponsmith who does exceptional work - a noble in the court or street urchin willing to impart valuable information - a member of the city watch willing to look the other way or take their side in a dispute - a farmer glad to shelter them - an orphanage of kids that admire the adventurers - an innkeeper who used to be an adventurer until he took an arrow to the knee Just remember they need to be loyal, competent, and useful. Annoying NPC's aren't going to be cared about. Throughout the campaign, keep these people safe and loyal. Don't use them as hostages or have them turn traitorous (you can do this with other NPCs, just decide ahead of time that these ones are reliable allies and resources). But don't hesitate to let the world harm them if a plot is ignored or failed. Having real friends will motivate the PC's to act like real heroes, or at least give them something to care about besides treasure and power. I think this is especially important in sandbox campaigns, since players are deciding the direction of the campaign. They often want to be heroic, but DM's don't give them the opportunity. Even mercenaries who don't care about these characters want the ability to express that, so the existence of these types of characters is good for everyone. 6. Be ready to drop (or change) your favorite stuff. If they don't express interest in a plot or a character, you have to stop pushing it and develop something else. You can always bring back that character or plot later, reskinning it to something they might be interested in. This point is why I say don't over prepare. If you spend hours detailing the town of Whateverville, only to see them yawn and decide to leave to go to Niftytown, you've wasted your time and made the game less fun for you. One thing you can do is take the cool parts of Whateverville that they haven't seen yet, and plug them into Niftytown. If they haven't experienced it yet, you shouldn't throw it out, just move it. Same goes for NPCs. If they never meet Baron Somesuch because they never went to that part of the map, move him and rename him if you must. Just don't push something that the majority of your players clearly have no interest in, drop it, even if you liked it. Maybe you can use it in another campaign or later. 7. It's ok to railroad for a little while. Even in a sandbox, there are times when the party will be involved in a sequence of events that you've planned out. This is ok, as long as they seem to enjoy it, and as long as it's not too long and restrictive. I mention this because I think a lot of DM's get afraid of railroading, but hey, every now and then a good old fashioned dungeon crawl or a series of gauntlet style encounters can be fun. I especially think it's ok to throw in a published adventure in the middle of a sandbox campaign, treating it as just another plot that they can pursue, delay or abandon as they see fit. You could even do this with multiple planned adventures. After all, three railroads aren't really a railroad. [/QUOTE]
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