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General Tabletop Discussion
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DM's: How transparent are you with game mechanics "in world?"
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<blockquote data-quote="Chaosmancer" data-source="post: 8396787" data-attributes="member: 6801228"><p>I disagree that the design of the game must include the potential for the DM to abuse ultimate power. Again, I don't see what we need all this power for anyways. Lyxen has gone forward saying that the DM can make a rule that allows them to use weighted dice. Why is that a thing we are going to say the rules allow them to do? </p><p></p><p>In no other game, in no other context, do we give people this much unbridled authority. There are RPGs I've planned, and forums I've visited where these sort of claims would get you laughed out of the conversation, yet I have two people making them here.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Changing our perspective on what it means to be a DM. Stop calling them "Masters", stop treating them like they are smarter, wiser, more creative and all the rest than the players. Acknowledge that the game involves multiple parties, and multiple voices, and all of them should be heard and considered. </p><p></p><p>Consider that instead of the rules being seen as a limit on the creativity of the DM, to be discarded at a whim, if we instead viewed them as very solid guidelines for how to approach situations, and that you shouldn't discard them without a very good reason and careful consideration. Perhaps even a discussion with your players. </p><p></p><p>No rules are changed, and yet, making this a standard approach in the community may do a lot. Along with us stopping treating any player with an opinion as a problem.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>RAW and RAI are acknowledged to be different things. And I don't think the intent of the people who designed the rules was to have DMs ignore all rules in pursuit of their own aggrandizement. I think the intent was to give enough freedom to tweak things to fit better to specific circumstances, which is far less than the power you give DMs.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>How will he improve? No one can tell him what he is doing is wrong, the rules support what he is doing. Players who complain are just, to borrow a phrase from Lyxen "entitled little ****." or if they are asking questions then they are distrusting their DM, and that's bad, or hounding them to death, or just a powergamer seeking any advantage, or or or or. </p><p></p><p>We have dozens of ways to label bad players, that excuse a DM from all wrong doing, so how is a DM supposed to learn and improve? If they come to these forums and ask why their players are unhappy, while explaining their intentions (not necessarily their results) they are likely to be told that their players are ungrateful for all the hard work, and that they've done nothing wrong. That the players are wrong for questioning them. </p><p></p><p>And, since I believe that a Bad DM can improve, I have no problem saying that in a specific game, a DM was a Bad DM. It could also be that you are using the term more narrowly, since you seem to think that intentional vindictiveness is needed to be a Bad DM.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>1 in 700 people, when estimates are that you will likely encounter around 10,000 people in your life is not that rare. In fact, you should likely meet about 14 people with Down's using those rough estimates. </p><p></p><p>And unlike genetic diseases, people's attitudes in a game that we willing participate in, should be something that we can address and try and improve. And even if it is rare, does that mean we shouldn't attempt improvement? I don't think so, especially since improvement is likely coming at so little cost.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>No, like I told them, all I was saying is that I didn't know for certain, and that I was likely wrong about my assumptions. Good Lord, can a person not say that they don't want to make an assumption without getting jumped for calling people liars?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Chaosmancer, post: 8396787, member: 6801228"] I disagree that the design of the game must include the potential for the DM to abuse ultimate power. Again, I don't see what we need all this power for anyways. Lyxen has gone forward saying that the DM can make a rule that allows them to use weighted dice. Why is that a thing we are going to say the rules allow them to do? In no other game, in no other context, do we give people this much unbridled authority. There are RPGs I've planned, and forums I've visited where these sort of claims would get you laughed out of the conversation, yet I have two people making them here. Changing our perspective on what it means to be a DM. Stop calling them "Masters", stop treating them like they are smarter, wiser, more creative and all the rest than the players. Acknowledge that the game involves multiple parties, and multiple voices, and all of them should be heard and considered. Consider that instead of the rules being seen as a limit on the creativity of the DM, to be discarded at a whim, if we instead viewed them as very solid guidelines for how to approach situations, and that you shouldn't discard them without a very good reason and careful consideration. Perhaps even a discussion with your players. No rules are changed, and yet, making this a standard approach in the community may do a lot. Along with us stopping treating any player with an opinion as a problem. RAW and RAI are acknowledged to be different things. And I don't think the intent of the people who designed the rules was to have DMs ignore all rules in pursuit of their own aggrandizement. I think the intent was to give enough freedom to tweak things to fit better to specific circumstances, which is far less than the power you give DMs. How will he improve? No one can tell him what he is doing is wrong, the rules support what he is doing. Players who complain are just, to borrow a phrase from Lyxen "entitled little ****." or if they are asking questions then they are distrusting their DM, and that's bad, or hounding them to death, or just a powergamer seeking any advantage, or or or or. We have dozens of ways to label bad players, that excuse a DM from all wrong doing, so how is a DM supposed to learn and improve? If they come to these forums and ask why their players are unhappy, while explaining their intentions (not necessarily their results) they are likely to be told that their players are ungrateful for all the hard work, and that they've done nothing wrong. That the players are wrong for questioning them. And, since I believe that a Bad DM can improve, I have no problem saying that in a specific game, a DM was a Bad DM. It could also be that you are using the term more narrowly, since you seem to think that intentional vindictiveness is needed to be a Bad DM. 1 in 700 people, when estimates are that you will likely encounter around 10,000 people in your life is not that rare. In fact, you should likely meet about 14 people with Down's using those rough estimates. And unlike genetic diseases, people's attitudes in a game that we willing participate in, should be something that we can address and try and improve. And even if it is rare, does that mean we shouldn't attempt improvement? I don't think so, especially since improvement is likely coming at so little cost. No, like I told them, all I was saying is that I didn't know for certain, and that I was likely wrong about my assumptions. Good Lord, can a person not say that they don't want to make an assumption without getting jumped for calling people liars? [/QUOTE]
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