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<blockquote data-quote="gorice" data-source="post: 8758512" data-attributes="member: 7032863">OK. I've explained that I'm neither able nor willing to get into the details of this with you ATM. I will say that the Greek origin of slavery (IIRC from Chios) was a traditional view, based on a throwaway line by a source whose name I forget. I will not defend it, and it is a distraction from the argument. I'm not here to score points.Anyway: chattel slavery is, by definition, the buying and selling of human beings. The Romans and Greeks most certainly bought and sold human beings. I'm not sure what else there is to say; you haven't offered any concrete objections.If you can't see the affinity between Dark Sun and something like the film Spartacus (slave markets, gladiatorial arenas, slaves revolting against a decadent plutocracy, and, most importantly, scantily clad warriors covered in sweat), I don't know what to say to you.As for 'American exceptionalism', perhaps it was a poor choice of words. It remains true that the US does not have a monopoly on the history chattel slavery. I will add that, in my personal experience, American ideological hegemony is such that one does not have to be American to believe American historical narratives.In any case, your proposed solution is unfortunately likely to be the correct one. I'm well aware of the various forms of human unfreedom; but it genuinely saddens me that so many people believe that chattel slavery cannot be treated in fiction because of its 'unique' association with the Atlantic slave trade and US history (incidentally, this also lets the Romans off the hook and puts wind in the sails of those spouting genuinely reactionary 'Western Civilisation' narratives, but that's another can of worms).</blockquote>

[QUOTE="gorice, post: 8758512, member: 7032863"] OK. I've explained that I'm neither able nor willing to get into the details of this with you ATM. I will say that the Greek origin of slavery (IIRC from Chios) was a [I]traditional[/I] view, based on a throwaway line by a source whose name I forget. I will not defend it, and it is a distraction from the argument. I'm not here to score points. Anyway: chattel slavery is, by definition, the buying and selling of human beings. The Romans and Greeks most certainly bought and sold human beings. I'm not sure what else there is to say; you haven't offered any concrete objections. If you can't see the affinity between Dark Sun and something like the film [I]Spartacus[/I] (slave markets, gladiatorial arenas, slaves revolting against a decadent plutocracy, and, most importantly, scantily clad warriors covered in sweat), I don't know what to say to you. As for 'American exceptionalism', perhaps it was a poor choice of words. It remains true that the US does not have a monopoly on the history chattel slavery. I will add that, in my personal experience, American ideological hegemony is such that one does not have to be American to believe American historical narratives. In any case, your proposed solution is unfortunately likely to be the correct one. I'm well aware of the various forms of human unfreedom; but it genuinely saddens me that so many people believe that chattel slavery cannot be treated in fiction because of its 'unique' association with the Atlantic slave trade and US history (incidentally, this also lets the Romans off the hook and puts wind in the sails of those spouting genuinely reactionary 'Western Civilisation' narratives, but that's another can of worms). [/QUOTE]

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