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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Argyle King" data-source="post: 5592571" data-attributes="member: 58416">Actually, the Brawler fight does gain a proficiency bonus with unarmed attacks.  Also, there's no reason why you can't choose an Expertise feat and choose unarmed strikes as your weapon.  That helps take care of the proficiency bonus.Damage is a little tougher to make up for, but it's not impossible.  The Brutal Brawler feat changes your damage to d6 instead of d4.  Weapon Focus and other such feats can apply to unarmed attacks.  There are also feats which allow you to cause damage when a creature fails to escape your grab; I believe there's also one which causes damage even when you fail a grab.  The nice thing about this is that there's no attack roll, so you can't miss with the auto damage.  Sure, it might not be a lot of damage, but it's constant.You can still attack while you have someone grabbed, so I imagine you could manage ok damage with a ground & pound tactic against opponents.  They're taking damage from your grab while also continuing to take damage from you punching them into submission.  I wouldn't claim it was optimized by any means, but I think it's pretty cool, and it doesn't seem to be gimped too terribly.  You just need to use different tactics to get the best mileage out of it.I'll also add that none of this is taking into consideration any stances or other such things you might have which also deal damage.  There are a few things you can pick up via Multiclassing which match up well too.  I'm away from my books at the moment, but I believe there's a barbarian feat which allows you to throw offhand weapons 5 squares; unarmed strikes count as being offhand.  Without MCing, I believe there's a PP in Martial Power 1 which increases the damage dice of offhand weapons you wield by one step.  If they were already d6 from Brutal Brawler, they would become d8, right?</blockquote>

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