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Message: <blockquote data-quote="empireofchaos" data-source="post: 6782728" data-attributes="member: 6800918">I don't know what you think is inevitable about your conclusion (and if I were so inclined, I would snip at you for telling me how I have to play the game). I was quite clear that the 1% (or .1%, really) was an assumption, but one based on several factors, which I outlined (knowledge about how agricultural societies work, and a sort of middle-of-the-road view of gamers on this list thinking about the issue; I could throw in the fact that several designers I respect think along these lines also). The examples you throw out (e.g. monsters ruling the world, PC-type heroes being 1-in-a-billion) are possible settings, but, a question for you: are those your settings? And also, how many such settings are you aware of? How common are they? My point is, in a common, FR-type setting, the assumptions I'm making are hardly implausible, meaning that there is a clear logic about why organized classes would fit into the setting.I am a little surprised by several people's contentions that many powerful NPCs are unclassed. If that's the way you want it, fine. I would just say that I personally would prefer to spend time designing classes or archetypes for "non-standard" PCs rather than spending time throwing together monster-like stat blocks for NPCs - assuming they have a class seems much easier for me (from the point of view of gearing their challenge to the PCs, among other reasons). From what I see in current generation published adventures (e.g. LMoP), the commonality of classed NPCs doesn't seem like an unwarranted assumption in the eyes of most players.OK - on empires - they don't exist throughout time and space, but the empire form is the most widespread and durable form of agricultural social organization from c.4000 BCE to to 1800 CE. That's why it's modeled in so many frpg settings. But there can be others, yes, though even in more decentralized frameworks, there would still likely be some efforts to control individuals with special powers (e.g. Ged the Sparrohawk, who became Archmage in LeGuin's Wizard of Earthsea).And yes, that is one of the reasons why I stipulated from the get-go that some individuals do not fit into the scheme, and for a variety of reasons, may escape social control. But that hardly means that everyone is able to do so, and that class structures do not therefore exist. If someone wants to play a character who does not fit, I would sit down with the player, and try to figure out a way to either fit the character with some sort of non-standard in-game narrative, or to design a new class or archetype for the character, with the possible allowance that the class is much more amorphous and unregulated than existing classes. That's been my position all along.</blockquote>

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