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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Sacrosanct" data-source="post: 6729414" data-attributes="member: 15700">What shifting of the goal posts am I doing?  I've been consistent the entire time in my position that a character isn't defined by only what is a clearly defined ability on a character sheet.  You're the one who said only people who don't care about options or character variation would play a fighter.  And then shifted your goal posts to talk only mechanical options (which was still a fallacy)Have you even played 5e?  You do realize that I'm not talking about any houserule.  In 5e's context, there are things like the DC mechanic that handles 99% of what I was talking about.  Wanna do something not on our sheet?  Have the DM come up with a DC based on the guidelines and go to town.  That's not a custom houserule.I didn't modify your quote.  I quoted directly in my original quote, and again in post 53.  Either way, it's beside the point because it's still wrong.  You've had two of us come right out and say that we prefer fighters and not for the reasons you gave.  It literally has nothing to do with not caring at all, or "as much" about options.You made a claim ascribing peoples' motivations who like fighters.  People who like fighters said you're wrong in your assumptions.  That's it.  You even doubled down in your fallacy on post 60*  And rather than admit you were wrong in your assumption, you're spinning in circles trying to change your argument to mean something other than what you said.*""Players who don't care as much about in combat options" - Fighters have less mechanical combat options. If you want more combat options, it's not as good of a choice."Not true.  Lots of people play fighters and also like options.  Several reason include but are not limited to: 1) they like the class, 2) options aren't limited to a defined ability"Or character variation." - Fighters, again, have less mechanical options, most of which any character can do. If you want a character that plays different, you're not going to want a pick a fighter."Also not true.  Character variation is more defined by how you as a player play your PC than a class.  A single fighter can be a swashbuckler, soldier, knight, bruiser, etc.  Not to mention personality differences.  If fact, a statement like this displays a tremendous amount of ignorance to how people played D&D for the first 25 years of it's existence before feat bloat came with 3e.</blockquote>

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