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Message: <blockquote data-quote="tetrasodium" data-source="post: 8268572" data-attributes="member: 93670">Again it depends.  You can look at fate as a great example.   Combat in fate largely falls into categories of near competence porn cinematic fun where the outcome is all but certain, an almost immediate "let's work out a concession "(a mutually agreed upon loss basically), and a death spiral so deep that it's difficult to Express without getting pretty deep  into system kechsnics.   In fate you can lose some stress no big deal and maybe risk a m ok not consequence, but "I'm taken out" even knowing that the the other side could just say how you die  can be preferable to taking more serious consequences. That style is a terrible fit for d&d but it works great for fate because the system & gameplay is so incredibly different.  Death spirals in meatgrinders like dcc  can be a lot of fun.  In d&d though death spirals need to split into two use cases.The first is the boring crutch tables and such that just keep making you worse arbitrarily, those tend to just feel like the annoying bolt ons ether are. Tge second  are things like 3.x wraith attribute damage & trog stench debuff or even the old ghoul paralysis where the point was to make nonthreatening opponents feel scary or become difficult by bringing those things into the field. Without technically needing to actually begin a death spiral.</blockquote>