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<blockquote data-quote="DonTadow" data-source="post: 2294324" data-attributes="member: 22622">Great Advice.&nbsp;&nbsp; I also want to clarify my earlier arguments, I mean professional thief.&nbsp; I have a bard in my campaign who is straight bard but is more of a jester.&nbsp; &quot;complete with clown outfit&quot;.&nbsp; He is more of a thief than the rogue in the party.&nbsp; Even the thief makes jokes about his as he calls it &quot;preserving artifacts in case they do not succeed and the world does end&quot;.&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Again its up to us to nurture creatvity in players and help them think outside the box.&nbsp; My Psychic Warrior read a prestige called Trophy Hunter but I didn't want it in the game.&nbsp; I told her she could easily just collect heads and continue with her class which would be better.&nbsp; Now she makes belts adorned with skulls and took some craft bone skills.&nbsp; No prestige needed.&nbsp; Again the Bard is a wonderful Jester, thief, stand-up comedian and coward with no prestige classes, just creative rpg'n, skills and feats.&nbsp; YOu got to find the balance and teach the balance.&nbsp; A lot of us are great DMs but are we great teachers.&nbsp; I can't complain about one player I've ever had, even the bad ones because I feel like somewhere i tought them something.&nbsp; When I first started Chrsytaria I had 6 gamers whom were completely about mechanics.&nbsp; If it didnt say it they didn't know how to do it.&nbsp; They wanted to role for anything.&nbsp; They assumed I was skipping vital elements because I didn't request a roll.&nbsp; They get on a horse, they want a ride check every time.&nbsp; If someone did something against the law they'd complain becaus the paladin detected evil.&nbsp; They eventually left the group (because of attendance problems not playing style) but I know in the end they at least learned or were learning.&nbsp; I began as a mechanical head and then the next campaign was a complete turn around.&nbsp; 3.5 diceless game.&nbsp; Whereas I would never do one and the game got boring in parts, it really showed me how you can do things in teh game without mechanics and dice rolls and just good role playing and character building.&nbsp; We all had prestiges and the DM encouraged them because he enjoyed the role playing value of them as do I.&nbsp; There were just some things that feats and skills couldn't do like Divine Agent.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="DonTadow, post: 2294324, member: 22622"] Great Advice. I also want to clarify my earlier arguments, I mean professional thief. I have a bard in my campaign who is straight bard but is more of a jester. "complete with clown outfit". He is more of a thief than the rogue in the party. Even the thief makes jokes about his as he calls it "preserving artifacts in case they do not succeed and the world does end". Again its up to us to nurture creatvity in players and help them think outside the box. My Psychic Warrior read a prestige called Trophy Hunter but I didn't want it in the game. I told her she could easily just collect heads and continue with her class which would be better. Now she makes belts adorned with skulls and took some craft bone skills. No prestige needed. Again the Bard is a wonderful Jester, thief, stand-up comedian and coward with no prestige classes, just creative rpg'n, skills and feats. YOu got to find the balance and teach the balance. A lot of us are great DMs but are we great teachers. I can't complain about one player I've ever had, even the bad ones because I feel like somewhere i tought them something. When I first started Chrsytaria I had 6 gamers whom were completely about mechanics. If it didnt say it they didn't know how to do it. They wanted to role for anything. They assumed I was skipping vital elements because I didn't request a roll. They get on a horse, they want a ride check every time. If someone did something against the law they'd complain becaus the paladin detected evil. They eventually left the group (because of attendance problems not playing style) but I know in the end they at least learned or were learning. I began as a mechanical head and then the next campaign was a complete turn around. 3.5 diceless game. Whereas I would never do one and the game got boring in parts, it really showed me how you can do things in teh game without mechanics and dice rolls and just good role playing and character building. We all had prestiges and the DM encouraged them because he enjoyed the role playing value of them as do I. There were just some things that feats and skills couldn't do like Divine Agent. [/QUOTE]

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