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Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Do the initiative rules discourage parley?
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<blockquote data-quote="Celebrim" data-source="post: 2197571" data-attributes="member: 4937"><p>Well, that's why I put 'take 20' in quotes, because although it is effectively the same as taking 20, it's not actually the same mechanic as taking 20 with a skill check. At all.</p><p></p><p>This is one of those things - like weapon sizes - that I don't like about 3.5.</p><p></p><p>If you'll look on page 134 of the 3.0 Player's Handbook, you'll see a tiny little entry in the middle of the page for 'Refocus'. My understanding is that it disappeared from 3.5. That's a shame, because as a DM I've found it one of the most useful tools for sorting things out. Basically, it lets you take 20 on your initiative as a full round action where you just observe whats going on around you and get ready to act. As I understand it, 3.5 got rid of it by letting you take a Ready action that would effectively move your action to the top of the initiative order at the beginning of the next turn. That's not quite the same thing, and it has both positive and negative qualities. On the positive side, you never lose a turn getting refocused to people with extremely high initiative counts. On the negative side, it confuses people as to who actually goes first when two people are in a 'ready action' standoff. The answer is 'the one with the highest initiative bonus', but its much much clearer that that is true if you explicitly look at it as 'taking 20' on intiative. Also, its just alot more conceptually simple (and in my opinion cinematically cool) to think of it as 'refocusing' and taking 20 on your initiative, than to think of it in terms of the somewhat confusing 'ready' action.</p><p></p><p>Refocus ends up happening alot in my campaign. People who are hiding who have a couple of rounds to observe the target will take it to ensure that they have a high initiative. Spell casters or other 'second rank' types that don't have available targets (or don't want to spend a spell) will use it whenever they think that they can get away with it (it's not as safe of a choice as total defense). I _make_ anyone take it who seems to be unduly delaying, dithering and unsure of what to do, as in "Come on its a combat, you don't have 30 minutes to plan out your move like this was a chess game.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Celebrim, post: 2197571, member: 4937"] Well, that's why I put 'take 20' in quotes, because although it is effectively the same as taking 20, it's not actually the same mechanic as taking 20 with a skill check. At all. This is one of those things - like weapon sizes - that I don't like about 3.5. If you'll look on page 134 of the 3.0 Player's Handbook, you'll see a tiny little entry in the middle of the page for 'Refocus'. My understanding is that it disappeared from 3.5. That's a shame, because as a DM I've found it one of the most useful tools for sorting things out. Basically, it lets you take 20 on your initiative as a full round action where you just observe whats going on around you and get ready to act. As I understand it, 3.5 got rid of it by letting you take a Ready action that would effectively move your action to the top of the initiative order at the beginning of the next turn. That's not quite the same thing, and it has both positive and negative qualities. On the positive side, you never lose a turn getting refocused to people with extremely high initiative counts. On the negative side, it confuses people as to who actually goes first when two people are in a 'ready action' standoff. The answer is 'the one with the highest initiative bonus', but its much much clearer that that is true if you explicitly look at it as 'taking 20' on intiative. Also, its just alot more conceptually simple (and in my opinion cinematically cool) to think of it as 'refocusing' and taking 20 on your initiative, than to think of it in terms of the somewhat confusing 'ready' action. Refocus ends up happening alot in my campaign. People who are hiding who have a couple of rounds to observe the target will take it to ensure that they have a high initiative. Spell casters or other 'second rank' types that don't have available targets (or don't want to spend a spell) will use it whenever they think that they can get away with it (it's not as safe of a choice as total defense). I _make_ anyone take it who seems to be unduly delaying, dithering and unsure of what to do, as in "Come on its a combat, you don't have 30 minutes to plan out your move like this was a chess game. [/QUOTE]
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Do the initiative rules discourage parley?
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