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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Primitive Screwhead" data-source="post: 2208616" data-attributes="member: 20805">Surprising Hobo..I should have stated 'applicable checks to avoid surprise, be it Spot, Sense Motive, or whatever is appropriate, with hefty bonuses for the ambusher's'If a PC is distracted at the critical moment and does not notice that the Hobo is awake and belligerant.... *and* the Hobo can get up, close with, and destroy said PC in the standard action only surprise round....without knowing which, if any, PC is flatfooted... yes.And yes, thats one heck of a Hobo! In the Hobo circumstance, there is virtually no chance of the Hobo getting the drop on the entire party, but is possible for one PC.In the gunfighter scenario, its the same mechanic but seems less silly....The surprise round is the 3 seconds worth of the combatants brains going 'oh S&&*' as steel prepared to cut flesh. Luck, skill, and training can overcome this 3 second delay as your brain kicks into gear. A previous poster mentioned how he experienced this in martial arts tournements.IMHO, the initiative system works well as a whole in all but the very weird situations. The key is defining very clearly when to apply the game term of 'combat starts'.</blockquote>