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<blockquote data-quote="Umbran" data-source="post: 5246609" data-attributes="member: 177">Yes, but the point is that if D&amp;D hadn't been there to begin with, V:tM and the other White Wolf games probably would have flopped.&nbsp; Strong dependence only shows up if your potential market's desires are extremely narrow.&nbsp; Otherwise, this is only true in a broad sense.&nbsp; White Wolf is a &quot;little friend&quot; - their offering there is still recognizably a role playing game, but mechanically and thematically quite different.&nbsp; You don't always have to copy the Big Boy to take advantage of its existence.&nbsp; You can get just as much, probably more, mileage out of using the Big Boy as a contrast.&nbsp; &quot;We are not D&amp;D,&quot; is a valid marketing point for the little friends, and they can and should use that.&nbsp; It keeps the Big Boy on his toes.It has done so for decades, so the model is pretty well-tested.&nbsp; And, I think it is required going forward.&nbsp; Why?&nbsp; Because the resources of a Big Boy are required to help drive RPGs into the technological future.&nbsp; As others have recently noted around here, D&amp;D is not primarily in competition with other RPGs.&nbsp; The question WotC wants answered is not, &quot;Will this customer buy D&amp;D instead of Mousegard?&quot;&nbsp; The question is, &quot;Will this person play a tabletop RPG instead of playing with their Wii, or instead of going to the new 3D Movie?&quot;&nbsp; RPGs are primarily in competition with all the other forms of entertainment out there first, and with each other only a distant second.To compete effectively in the long run, just publishing a few new source books will not be enough.&nbsp; The hobby needs its network externalities (places like EN World, f'rex) maintained, and new technologies developed and adopted.&nbsp; Those efforts require greater resources and market presence than tiny game publishers can manage.&nbsp; Together, the little guys need a Big Boy to do this for them.&nbsp; They'll repay the favor in creative juices.This is the worst model ever!&nbsp; Except for all the others....You speak as if this same ecology doesn't exist in pretty much every other area of human endeavor.&nbsp; It is the model that naturally develops given the nature of our economic system, and the nature of humans, who you have to sell to.&nbsp; Is it perfect and 100% stable?&nbsp; No.&nbsp; But neither are ecologies.&nbsp; Life isn't 100% perfect and stable.&nbsp; Life is flux and adaptation.&nbsp; You need a mix of sizes and strengths to maintain balance through turbulence.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Umbran, post: 5246609, member: 177"] Yes, but the point is that if D&D hadn't been there to begin with, V:tM and the other White Wolf games probably would have flopped. Strong dependence only shows up if your potential market's desires are extremely narrow. Otherwise, this is only true in a broad sense. White Wolf is a "little friend" - their offering there is still recognizably a role playing game, but mechanically and thematically quite different. You don't always have to copy the Big Boy to take advantage of its existence. You can get just as much, probably more, mileage out of using the Big Boy as a contrast. "We are not D&D," is a valid marketing point for the little friends, and they can and should use that. It keeps the Big Boy on his toes. It has done so for decades, so the model is pretty well-tested. And, I think it is required going forward. Why? Because the resources of a Big Boy are required to help drive RPGs into the technological future. As others have recently noted around here, D&D is not primarily in competition with other RPGs. The question WotC wants answered is not, "Will this customer buy D&D instead of Mousegard?" The question is, "Will this person play a tabletop RPG instead of playing with their Wii, or instead of going to the new 3D Movie?" RPGs are primarily in competition with all the other forms of entertainment out there first, and with each other only a distant second. To compete effectively in the long run, just publishing a few new source books will not be enough. The hobby needs its network externalities (places like EN World, f'rex) maintained, and new technologies developed and adopted. Those efforts require greater resources and market presence than tiny game publishers can manage. Together, the little guys need a Big Boy to do this for them. They'll repay the favor in creative juices. This is the worst model ever! Except for all the others.... You speak as if this same ecology doesn't exist in pretty much every other area of human endeavor. It is the model that naturally develops given the nature of our economic system, and the nature of humans, who you have to sell to. Is it perfect and 100% stable? No. But neither are ecologies. [i]Life[/i] isn't 100% perfect and stable. Life is flux and adaptation. You need a mix of sizes and strengths to maintain balance through turbulence. [/QUOTE]

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