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Message: <blockquote data-quote="AngryPurpleCyclops" data-source="post: 4717596" data-attributes="member: 82732">Wizards are probably the toughest class to get down.  The start with guaranteed high AC and reflex (73% of all attacks target these).   The can easily have AC 18+ by level 1 or 2 and they can pump that AC to 22 for one round per combat (including blocking one hit retroactively) and this doesn't even factor in the chance from staff to block another hit.  Foes need to bunch in order to bring the wizards down.  It's not like one melee type is going to totally overwhelm  a wizard in most cases.  As soon as 2-3 monsters target a single wizard they open the door to the wizard (and other wizards in his party) all getting 2+ attacks per round.  This effectively lets a party with multiple wizards have a focus fire type effect on multiple targets simultaneously.  This is really the heart of the matter.  The OP was looking for the massive damage vs many targets capability that was wizards of old. (i.e. 10d6 fireballs doing 18/35 dmg to 3-10 targets at level 10)heavily is a stretch.  Pushing 2 squares instead of 3 isn't crippling, arcane reach is a tough feat to reach unless you're eladrin, then an initial 12 in dex means 15 at level 11 without any bumps on the 4/8 levels.  It's only one feat and not "critical".  Wisdom and Con are both good for wizards but you can get by with pumping mostly wisdom with an occasional point in con.  This will give acceptable values in both staff and orb at paragon+Not sure how this can possibly be 45 damage at level 6 (it's 3 possible damages) d6+IMP+INT and 2*(d10+IMP+INT) Int should be no more than +4 for a dwarf by this level and IMP should at most be +2 as well so that's 18+d6+2d10 = 44 max and only 1 time in 600 assuming you hit with thunderwave and the monster fails his save so call it 1 chance in over 2000.  You're still looking at 32 avg dmg in this kind of scenario.  I still agree that the sustainable daily powers with automatic dmg are the serious power in a wizards arsenal, just not quite as good as your post implies.Wizards are action challenged to some small degree and stuns and dazes can seriously hurt a wizards ability in an encounter.  This doesn't make them less valuable than the fighter it just demonstrates that when they aren't stunned or dazed they're usually getting an action economy that allows them to gain attacks and damages with minors and moves.  This is an upside not a downside.Save ends powers are awesome.  You can couple them with an orb wizard and seriously hinder one creature per encounter.  You can simply get lucky and have a creature or two struggle for rounds to shrug off a condition that robs them of actions or defenses or mobility or all three.  It can also mean free damage for rounds to come If you get 3-4 hits with fire shroud there's a better than even chance you'll get 30-40 extra damage and with a little luck you might be accumulating damage even 4-5 rounds later. what's amazing about wall of fog?  the -5 of stinking cloud works in both directions and wall of fog usually only is advantageous for one round.  This.This too.All of these.  Push a flying creature into a flying stinking cloud and if he makes his save he falls prone and crashes into the ground <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /></blockquote>

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