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<blockquote data-quote="CovertOps" data-source="post: 4719862" data-attributes="member: 65152">Let me just start with the obvious.&nbsp; If you give the Rogue a &quot;twin-strike&quot; like power then what is the point of playing a 2-weapon Ranger.&nbsp; It's his shtick.&nbsp; By doing so you are stepping into someone else's pool.&nbsp; Every class should have it's own unique features.&nbsp; For the Ranger they get a special way (mechanically) of performing their attack with 2 attack rolls and modified damage.&nbsp; Also (mechanically) the 2 attack rolls that the Ranger gets increases his odds of being able to apply his Hunter's Quarry damage (d6 or d8 with feat) to the target.&nbsp; If the Rogue had such a power then assuming the Rogue had CA he would pretty much get SA damage every round.&nbsp; I'm not going to crunch numbers and figure out what this does to average DPR (damage per round) for the Rogue, but I view this as a bad idea just from the standpoint of niche protection.If your Rogue really wants twin strike then just use your paragon path to do a full multiclass into ranger and take it with retraining.&nbsp; Oh wait....then your Rogue will need STR to use the attack.&nbsp; Such are the choices required when creating a character.&lt;sarcasm&gt;Perhaps next we should allow the Rogue to use Magic Missle...after all he's trained for years doing that too.&lt;/sarcasm&gt;Finally...why in the world do you need &quot;A way to justify not allowing the rogue in my group to make two attacks with his daggers&quot;.&nbsp; EVERYONE in the game is allowed to fight with 2 weapons.&nbsp; It just does NOT give you an extra attack.&nbsp; Reference Two-Weapon fighting&nbsp; and Two-Weapon Defense feats if he wants a bonus for using 2 weapons.&nbsp; EVERYONE gets one attack per standard action (reference use of Action Points).&nbsp; Some powers specify that you get to make 2 attack rolls (1 per target for AOE powers) as the game mechanic.&nbsp; These powers are balanced for the classes that get them.&nbsp; Granting these powers to other classes without any sacrifice on their part is bad mojo.Broken:RogueFeat1: Superior weapon Rapier (d8 damage - light blade)Feat2: Backstabber(increase SA damage to d8s)vsRanger with 2-weapon fighting optionFeat1: Superior weapon Bastard Sword (d10 damage)Feat2: Lethal Hunter(increase hunter's quarry damage to d8s)Using your new Rogue &quot;twin-strike&quot; power at level 1 your Rogue will be doing 2d8 + 2d6 SA per round compared to a ranger doing 2d10 + 1d6 HQ or 16 vs. 14.5At level 2 this widens to 2d8 + 2d8 SA or 18 compared to 2d10 + 1d8 HQ or 15.5</blockquote>

[QUOTE="CovertOps, post: 4719862, member: 65152"] Let me just start with the obvious. If you give the Rogue a "twin-strike" like power then what is the point of playing a 2-weapon Ranger. It's his shtick. By doing so you are stepping into someone else's pool. Every class should have it's own unique features. For the Ranger they get a special way (mechanically) of performing their attack with 2 attack rolls and modified damage. Also (mechanically) the 2 attack rolls that the Ranger gets increases his odds of being able to apply his Hunter's Quarry damage (d6 or d8 with feat) to the target. If the Rogue had such a power then assuming the Rogue had CA he would pretty much get SA damage every round. I'm not going to crunch numbers and figure out what this does to average DPR (damage per round) for the Rogue, but I view this as a bad idea just from the standpoint of niche protection. If your Rogue really wants twin strike then just use your paragon path to do a full multiclass into ranger and take it with retraining. Oh wait....then your Rogue will need STR to use the attack. Such are the choices required when creating a character. <sarcasm>Perhaps next we should allow the Rogue to use Magic Missle...after all he's trained for years doing that too.</sarcasm> Finally...why in the world do you need "A way to justify not allowing the rogue in my group to make two attacks with his daggers". EVERYONE in the game is allowed to fight with 2 weapons. It just does NOT give you an extra attack. Reference Two-Weapon fighting and Two-Weapon Defense feats if he wants a bonus for using 2 weapons. EVERYONE gets one attack per standard action (reference use of Action Points). Some powers specify that you get to make 2 attack rolls (1 per target for AOE powers) as the game mechanic. These powers are balanced for the classes that get them. Granting these powers to other classes without any sacrifice on their part is bad mojo. Broken: Rogue Feat1: Superior weapon Rapier (d8 damage - light blade) Feat2: Backstabber(increase SA damage to d8s) vs Ranger with 2-weapon fighting option Feat1: Superior weapon Bastard Sword (d10 damage) Feat2: Lethal Hunter(increase hunter's quarry damage to d8s) Using your new Rogue "twin-strike" power at level 1 your Rogue will be doing 2d8 + 2d6 SA per round compared to a ranger doing 2d10 + 1d6 HQ or 16 vs. 14.5 At level 2 this widens to 2d8 + 2d8 SA or 18 compared to 2d10 + 1d8 HQ or 15.5 [/QUOTE]

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