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<blockquote data-quote="Crazy Jerome" data-source="post: 5771526" data-attributes="member: 54877">The only time I really don't like an option being included is when its presence excludes something else that I wanted instead.&nbsp; And I don't mean by this simple things like page count or limited development time, either.&nbsp; You'll always get some A, B, and C when you would have preferred X, Y, and Z--but that's just the way things go.&nbsp;No, what is annoying is when a particular choice gets embedded into the game so that it can't be removed or replaced.&nbsp; For a silly example, take the early cleric class.&nbsp; He casts those divine spells, wears heavy armor, uses maces, turns undead, and is basically an early version of the &quot;divine paladin&quot; concept, shoehorned into the rules.&nbsp; Meanwhile, the &quot;magic user&quot; has to be excluded from healing and cures, because isn't he already doing enough?&nbsp; So if you have this idea of a &quot;wise man&quot; in robes with knowledge of plants and healing, you are out of luck.&nbsp; Then they add the druid, but to fit those established niches, they also give the druid shapechanging too.&nbsp; You are still out of luck. &nbsp;It took 4 full editions and however you want to count them several partial editions and extensions to develop &quot;class roles&quot; enough to work around that particular problem.&nbsp; Sometimes, it isn't just what gets included, but how you do it, that matters.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Crazy Jerome, post: 5771526, member: 54877"] The only time I [B]really[/B] don't like an option being included is when its presence excludes something else that I wanted instead. And I don't mean by this simple things like page count or limited development time, either. You'll always get some A, B, and C when you would have preferred X, Y, and Z--but that's just the way things go. No, what is annoying is when a particular choice gets embedded into the game so that it can't be removed or replaced. For a silly example, take the early cleric class. He casts those divine spells, wears heavy armor, uses maces, turns undead, and is basically an early version of the "divine paladin" concept, shoehorned into the rules. Meanwhile, the "magic user" has to be excluded from healing and cures, because isn't he already doing enough? So if you have this idea of a "wise man" in robes with knowledge of plants and healing, you are out of luck. Then they add the druid, but to fit those established niches, they also give the druid shapechanging too. You are still out of luck. It took 4 full editions and however you want to count them several partial editions and extensions to develop "class roles" enough to work around that particular problem. Sometimes, it isn't just what gets included, but how you do it, that matters. [/QUOTE]

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