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Message: <blockquote data-quote="udalrich" data-source="post: 3701315" data-attributes="member: 53796">This point I agree with.  I would probably change it to Evocation (SR: Yes) or slow the scaling of damage.The secondary effect requires a touch attack and a save, so there's a decent chance it will fail.     The secondary effect probably is still on the high side of the power curve for a 4th level single target spell.Which is why I want the nerf above.See above nerf.See above nerf.  (I know, I'm getting repetitive. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /> )Did I mention my nerf?   <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f61b.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":p" title="Stick out tongue    :p"  data-smilie="7"data-shortname=":p" /> If you want me to keep them as conjuration, then I'd scale the damage back to 1d6/two levels.To get 50+ points of damage regularly, we're probably looking at 15th level or so and 8th level spells.  If your 15th level mage is choosing to do damage and can't trigger a massive damage save, he needs to rebuild his character.You could also hit 50 damage at about 11th level with Empower.  If that makes it overpowered, Fireball is even more so, since it's a level lower and will do about the same damage from a 11th level caster.  To a group of enemies.4% is your estimate of how often it criticals or sneak attacks?  You could say the similar things about Enervation.  An average of 5 negative levels (from a Enervation critical) is going to make most people quite unhappy.  Especially if it's followed with a save-or-suck spell.The DMG guide for damage caps gives 15d6 for a 4th level, single target spell.  Single target spells increase their damage caps one level before area effect spells do.Usually, the caster can get off the area effect spell and not hit any friendlies.  In the last campaign I ran (level 3-12 with 6 PCs), the PC's were only hit with friendly fire about twice.  Both times it was the raging barbarian who was uninjured before the fireball.With the evocation nerf, there are more defenses.  Also, the damage is as average as for a fireball or cone of cold.  Do you generally dislike high-level, single target, ranged touch spells because it makes it easy to mop up the bad guy?The same thing applies to fireball and cone of cold.  If you just want to maximize damage, there's no reason to cast cone of cold below 14th level if you opponents don't have evasion.  Empowered fireball will beat it, no matter how likely they are to save.They're nice evocation spells.  Fix that problem and they're perfectly reasonable.</blockquote>

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