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Message: <blockquote data-quote="I'm A Banana" data-source="post: 4668721" data-attributes="member: 2067">I'm mostly not responding to every detail because (a) I want to avoid getting bogged down in fairly meaningless specifics and (b) I'm not interested in engaging in edition wars. I want to make sure I stay on-message here: 4e isn't very good when compared with other D&D editions if you're playing a game that doesn't want to focus on combat.With that said:It's wrong to assume that more vagueness is a good thing in "roleplaying." It's a matter of focus.Here is perhaps a heretical thought: Combat is no different from a skill check. They both do the same thing. Combat could be reduced to a skill check.Understand that, and you begin to understand where I'm coming from.But neither of them can support an mostly noncombat campaign in a satisfying way. It's not what they were designed to do. This leaves a gaping hole in 4e that wasn't so gaping before. They add a few noncombat options to a combat game just fine, but they don't support different genres and playstyles.Which is really my point: 4e doesn't really support a playstyle that isn't mostly about combat.There's never been a homogenous D&D. I've never met two DMs who have run the same game, even if they've run the same module. I've never met one DM who runs everything exactly by the books. The game is insanely diverse, whether or not it is supposed to be. Combat is one form of conflict resolution.What other forms are present in 4e that are as diverse, detailed, and interesting as 4e combat? Heck, half as diverse?It doesn't work if you don't also have combat in it, and it works a lot worse than it did in earlier editions for a host of reasons (especially because every character can do every thing). How many mistakes were there with the combat math, on publication?What does that tell you about how important these things are to the designers?What does that tell you about how much fun a game that focuses on something that the designers didn't even think was important enough to get exactly right on publication might be?So I assume you use it instead of combat, too, right?I mean, why use the combat system at all?This is only true if you're only using them to support a combat-focused game, or if you're truly comfortable with open-ended rules.If it's the latter, would you have a problem with skill challenges replacing combat in your game?If it's the former, well, that's my point.</blockquote>

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