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<blockquote data-quote="Lizard" data-source="post: 4670958" data-attributes="member: 1054">There is no room for dabblers or hobbyists, which cuts off a lot of character concepts. Since all non-combat skills have been reduced to &quot;Just write it on your character sheet, it doesn't matter&quot;, there's no way to focus on improving those aspects of your character, or competing with them, or using them in any kind of challenge or test, since they have no mechanical value. (You're a &quot;master brewer&quot;? Does that mean you can identify any kind of ale by taste? Fix a complex brewing mechanism? Train an apprentice? Out-brew an NPC? No ranks means no rolls, no rolls means it's all handwaving, and any of your fellow PCs can perk up and say &quot;I'm a master brewer, too!&quot; and have the exact same skill as you. (Oh, and they're also a master sailor, a hardened mercenary, a skilled blacksmith, and a tapestry weaver. Hey, it's all &quot;written down&quot;, right? What MORE do you need?))The scope of 4e campaigns, thus, is narrowed to &quot;Those campaigns where skills other than those listed never come into play&quot;, unless, of course, you design some house rules to account for them. I feel my old 3.5 Swashbuckler would have been less of a character without his Perform (Oratory) and Profession (Poet) ranks -- just &quot;writing them down&quot; would not have had nearly the same impact; the fact he spent skill points (a precious resource) on those things defined a lot about who he was. &quot;Just write it down&quot; is not, IMO, merely poor game design; it's actively contemptuous towards a style of play. It reduces non-combat abilities to the same status as eye color or hair style, something which should never enter play or be meaningful. This isn't &quot;freedom to roleplay&quot; -- it's stating that any aspects of your character not related to hitting things are irrelevant. I do not know if this was a design intent or just an emergent property of time/space constraints, but I consider it a significant flaw. (Yes, it can be houseruled very easily. This doesn't make it any less of a flaw.)</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Lizard, post: 4670958, member: 1054"] There is no room for dabblers or hobbyists, which cuts off a lot of character concepts. Since all non-combat skills have been reduced to "Just write it on your character sheet, it doesn't matter", there's no way to focus on improving those aspects of your character, or competing with them, or using them in any kind of challenge or test, since they have no mechanical value. (You're a "master brewer"? Does that mean you can identify any kind of ale by taste? Fix a complex brewing mechanism? Train an apprentice? Out-brew an NPC? No ranks means no rolls, no rolls means it's all handwaving, and any of your fellow PCs can perk up and say "I'm a master brewer, too!" and have the exact same skill as you. (Oh, and they're also a master sailor, a hardened mercenary, a skilled blacksmith, and a tapestry weaver. Hey, it's all "written down", right? What MORE do you need?)) The scope of 4e campaigns, thus, is narrowed to "Those campaigns where skills other than those listed never come into play", unless, of course, you design some house rules to account for them. I feel my old 3.5 Swashbuckler would have been less of a character without his Perform (Oratory) and Profession (Poet) ranks -- just "writing them down" would not have had nearly the same impact; the fact he spent skill points (a precious resource) on those things defined a lot about who he was. "Just write it down" is not, IMO, merely poor game design; it's actively contemptuous towards a style of play. It reduces non-combat abilities to the same status as eye color or hair style, something which should never enter play or be meaningful. This isn't "freedom to roleplay" -- it's stating that any aspects of your character not related to hitting things are irrelevant. I do not know if this was a design intent or just an emergent property of time/space constraints, but I consider it a significant flaw. (Yes, it can be houseruled very easily. This doesn't make it any less of a flaw.) [/QUOTE]

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