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Message: <blockquote data-quote="BryonD" data-source="post: 4674113" data-attributes="member: 957">I agree with you, but only to an extent.For the past 30 years my enjoyment of RPGs at the table has been very real.  But my enjoyment of RPGs as a creative exercise has been equally real.  And I'd readily wager that the total time I have spent greatly enjoying myself using the building kit aspect of RPGs is double or more the amount of time spent at tables with groups.And I am certain that games I have enjoyed were meant to be enjoyed BOTH ways.  4E has conciously rejected one of those ways and as you rightly state, is simply meant to offer the at-table enjoyment.  IMO the presumption of an audience that only cares about at-table activty and the presumption of an audience that needs the concept of level appropriate challenges hard wired onto the mechanics dove tail cleanly.</blockquote>