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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Xylix" data-source="post: 504444" data-attributes="member: 9089">*Chuckle*I probably should bother editing my posts, but they usually end up so darn long!Not quite,  I stated that those that agreeded with the premises must agree, if they are logical.The premises are the fundmental statments:e.g.Point out that he could not get everywhere in time.Point out that you can see what you parents buy, and if you are careful you can even show that those labled from Santa where indeed bought by your parents.If they dissagreed with teh premises I would be forced to prove those (or show them likely) to get them to accept them.  To do that I would have to make more premisies.and so on and so on....Eventually one of two things would happen:#1:  We would reach a stage where I managed to construct an argument (by prooving premisies as necessary) that consists of only premisies that they agree with.  If this happened if they where logical, and the logic of my argument was sound then they should agree  (this is inductive, in deductive they MUST agree).The problem with inductive is they can still believe, what is important though is they accept their postion is unlikey.#2:  There will be a point where one reaches a fundementally accepted premise.  That is not shared.   Such a premise is one that is accepted by the individual without question.  Perhaps things like 'Murder is wrong,  Nachos is good, the DMs manual is sacred,  etc....'In any case a fundmentally accepted premise is about possible to convince another not to accept, as they accept this without question.If you cannot disprove this fundemental premise, or get them to accept it (as you can never proove your own fundmental premise without first removing is fundmentalness, which risks disprooving it).  Then the argument cannot continue.   As such both parties recognize their differances, aplaud their use of logic and leave.If two people are presenting opposing ideas then #3 :  The opposite occures, your argument is disprooved.   In this case if the other is accepted as the most likely resultant you move to that if you are logical.  If there is another likely (in your mind) resultant you might go there instead.  In this case the argument resumes with one party presenting  a new argument.there is of course....#4 :  Everybody gets tired of talking.The stereotypical Christmas Santa is the only one I cared about.  Afterall this is only an example.As such when I used santa you should subsitute it for 'stereotypical Christmas Santa'You incorrectly presumed I was refering to all Santa's, just like I incorrectly presumed everyone would understand I would be talking about the 'sterotypical christmas santa'Nah,  I only care about the Neutral ones....When I started getting arguments that consisted of one statement I decided bothering with anyone else was pointless.Then after dealing with more raw statments I decided I would be happy if people just started attacking my premises.As such I do suppose my goal is partially successful.  At this point I wouldn't mind you destroying my argument as long as the board started using logic more commonly in arguments.   <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" />Afterall, I would merely house rule the result any way <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f600.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":D" title="Big grin    :D"  data-smilie="8"data-shortname=":D" /> Bring the fun!  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /></blockquote>

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