Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
NOW LIVE! Today's the day you meet your new best friend. You don’t have to leave Wolfy behind... In 'Pets & Sidekicks' your companions level up with you!
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
Does anyone else feel like 4ed isn't really a new edition?
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Jer" data-source="post: 3764869" data-attributes="member: 19857"><p>The 2e -> 3e change was a massive one because 2e used mechanics that were already feeling dated in 1989. Had the 2e designers been a little less worried about alienating their player base and a little more intent on streamlining and modernizing the rules, the 3e shift in 2000 might not have been as massive as it was. On the whole, the 1e -> 2e change was pretty small mechanics wise, and most of the initial changes were in organization and presentation, not rules. 2e later expanded on the initial rules with band-aid fixes like "character kits", but the initial 2e rules basically took stuff that was scattered around various 1e supplements and reorganized them into the "core rules", along with a few rules tweaks to some systems that were clearly broken.</p><p></p><p>Since the rules were already feeling dated in '89, and since a LOT of mechanics advancement in the RPG field in general happened between '89 and '99, the 3e change had to be massive just to get D&D up to the level of where the "state of the art" for the industry was in 2000.</p><p></p><p>That's not true now - D&D has moved back to being a leader in its particular niche of roleplaying rather than lagging far behind other systems. That means that the changes don't have to be as massive, nor should they be as massive. Other game systems do not change as radically as D&D 2e -> 3e from edition to edition, and that should be the norm that we expect in an upgrade - not the fairly anomalous massive shift that was 3e.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Jer, post: 3764869, member: 19857"] The 2e -> 3e change was a massive one because 2e used mechanics that were already feeling dated in 1989. Had the 2e designers been a little less worried about alienating their player base and a little more intent on streamlining and modernizing the rules, the 3e shift in 2000 might not have been as massive as it was. On the whole, the 1e -> 2e change was pretty small mechanics wise, and most of the initial changes were in organization and presentation, not rules. 2e later expanded on the initial rules with band-aid fixes like "character kits", but the initial 2e rules basically took stuff that was scattered around various 1e supplements and reorganized them into the "core rules", along with a few rules tweaks to some systems that were clearly broken. Since the rules were already feeling dated in '89, and since a LOT of mechanics advancement in the RPG field in general happened between '89 and '99, the 3e change had to be massive just to get D&D up to the level of where the "state of the art" for the industry was in 2000. That's not true now - D&D has moved back to being a leader in its particular niche of roleplaying rather than lagging far behind other systems. That means that the changes don't have to be as massive, nor should they be as massive. Other game systems do not change as radically as D&D 2e -> 3e from edition to edition, and that should be the norm that we expect in an upgrade - not the fairly anomalous massive shift that was 3e. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
Does anyone else feel like 4ed isn't really a new edition?
Top