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D&D Older Editions
Does Magic of Incarnum and 3e's Tome of Magic and Tome of Battle have a place in 5e?
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<blockquote data-quote="TheCosmicKid" data-source="post: 7323846" data-attributes="member: 6683613"><p>That was you? I had no idea. Regardless of the nitpicks, it's still hands-down my favorite 3E book, so from where I'm sitting you've got nothing to be ashamed of.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Nah, forever might work in a game like <em>Unknown Armies</em>, but it doesn't really fly in D&D. You do relearn them. Just slowly, and unreliably, and you might wish you hadn't. It's old-school Vance through the filter of Lovecraft.</p><p></p><p>[sblock]</p><p><strong>Casting and Forgetting Spells</strong></p><p>The Occultist table shows how many spell slots you have to cast your spells of 1st level and higher. To cast one of these spells, you must make a special Charisma check (adding your proficiency bonus) against a DC of 10 + the level of the spell slot you are using. You have advantage on this check if you are in an area of dim light or darkness. If you succeed, you expend the spell slot and cast the spell. If you fail, you cast the spell, but do not expend the spell slot. Instead, you forget the spell entirely, as your mind revolts against the black magic's nightmare-logic. Remove it from your list of spells known.</p><p></p><p>If you wish, you can forgo the check and automatically forget the spell rather than expending the spell slot. You can even use this ability to cast a spell for which you have no available spell slots.</p><p></p><p>You regain all expended spell slots when you finish a long rest. Relearning forgotten spells is harder...</p><p></p><p><strong>Learning Spells</strong></p><p>When starting at 1st level, you know a number of 1st-level spells from the occultist spell list equal to your Charisma modifier + 1 (minimum of one spell). At any time, you can know a maximum number of spells equal to your Charisma modifier + your occultist level, and the spells must be of a level for which you have spell slots.</p><p></p><p>You learn the secrets of black magic through nightmarish dreams, and like all dreams your spells are elusive to the waking mind. If, through forgetting spells, you know fewer than your maximum, you experience a nightmare during your next long rest. Within the nightmare is one spell, of the level of your choice but selected at random from that level on the occultist spell list. Immediately after you finish the long rest, you must speak to another willing creature or write about your nightmare for at least twenty minutes in order to learn the spell. If you do not, not only do you learn nothing, you lose the benefits of the long rest and gain one level of exhaustion, as the uncomprehended mysteries take their toll on your sanity. A creature that you speak to, or any creature that studies what you've written, also gains a level of exhaustion.</p><p></p><p>You can also relearn a spell you previously learned through a nightmare by spending twenty minutes studying your writing on the nightmare. Discerning the magic from the gibberish is difficult, even though you yourself are the author, and you must succeed on an Intelligence check (adding your proficiency bonus) with a DC of 10 + the spell's level to learn the spell. You also gain an exhaustion level unless you succeed on the check by 5 or more. Whether you succeed or fail, you cannot again try to learn a spell this way until you finish a long rest.</p><p></p><p>Finally, you can learn a spell by spending twenty minutes studying the nightmare writing of another occultist with whom you share a common language, or listening to the occultist recount his or her dream. This is similar to studying your own writing, but the DC of the Intelligence check is increased by the other occultist's Charisma bonus, and you gain the exhaustion level automatically. Again, whether you succeed or fail, you cannot try to learn another spell this way until you finish a long rest. (This method is distinct from studying your own writing, and you can do both.)</p><p></p><p>Nightmare writings are unique: all attempts to copy them fail to recapture the essence of the nightmare, and are useless to occultists.[/sblock]</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="TheCosmicKid, post: 7323846, member: 6683613"] That was you? I had no idea. Regardless of the nitpicks, it's still hands-down my favorite 3E book, so from where I'm sitting you've got nothing to be ashamed of. Nah, forever might work in a game like [I]Unknown Armies[/I], but it doesn't really fly in D&D. You do relearn them. Just slowly, and unreliably, and you might wish you hadn't. It's old-school Vance through the filter of Lovecraft. [sblock] [B]Casting and Forgetting Spells[/B] The Occultist table shows how many spell slots you have to cast your spells of 1st level and higher. To cast one of these spells, you must make a special Charisma check (adding your proficiency bonus) against a DC of 10 + the level of the spell slot you are using. You have advantage on this check if you are in an area of dim light or darkness. If you succeed, you expend the spell slot and cast the spell. If you fail, you cast the spell, but do not expend the spell slot. Instead, you forget the spell entirely, as your mind revolts against the black magic's nightmare-logic. Remove it from your list of spells known. If you wish, you can forgo the check and automatically forget the spell rather than expending the spell slot. You can even use this ability to cast a spell for which you have no available spell slots. You regain all expended spell slots when you finish a long rest. Relearning forgotten spells is harder... [B]Learning Spells[/B] When starting at 1st level, you know a number of 1st-level spells from the occultist spell list equal to your Charisma modifier + 1 (minimum of one spell). At any time, you can know a maximum number of spells equal to your Charisma modifier + your occultist level, and the spells must be of a level for which you have spell slots. You learn the secrets of black magic through nightmarish dreams, and like all dreams your spells are elusive to the waking mind. If, through forgetting spells, you know fewer than your maximum, you experience a nightmare during your next long rest. Within the nightmare is one spell, of the level of your choice but selected at random from that level on the occultist spell list. Immediately after you finish the long rest, you must speak to another willing creature or write about your nightmare for at least twenty minutes in order to learn the spell. If you do not, not only do you learn nothing, you lose the benefits of the long rest and gain one level of exhaustion, as the uncomprehended mysteries take their toll on your sanity. A creature that you speak to, or any creature that studies what you've written, also gains a level of exhaustion. You can also relearn a spell you previously learned through a nightmare by spending twenty minutes studying your writing on the nightmare. Discerning the magic from the gibberish is difficult, even though you yourself are the author, and you must succeed on an Intelligence check (adding your proficiency bonus) with a DC of 10 + the spell's level to learn the spell. You also gain an exhaustion level unless you succeed on the check by 5 or more. Whether you succeed or fail, you cannot again try to learn a spell this way until you finish a long rest. Finally, you can learn a spell by spending twenty minutes studying the nightmare writing of another occultist with whom you share a common language, or listening to the occultist recount his or her dream. This is similar to studying your own writing, but the DC of the Intelligence check is increased by the other occultist's Charisma bonus, and you gain the exhaustion level automatically. Again, whether you succeed or fail, you cannot try to learn another spell this way until you finish a long rest. (This method is distinct from studying your own writing, and you can do both.) Nightmare writings are unique: all attempts to copy them fail to recapture the essence of the nightmare, and are useless to occultists.[/sblock] [/QUOTE]
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Does Magic of Incarnum and 3e's Tome of Magic and Tome of Battle have a place in 5e?
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