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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Ashrym" data-source="post: 8398871" data-attributes="member: 6750235">It's not underpowered or overpowered.  It's just powered.  ;-)I never felt underpowered on an alchemist.  The other subclasses are more efficient but the alchemist does add versatility over them and focuses more on actual healing.  Different focus isn't the same thing as underpowered.If the armor proficiencies are good enough for a ranger then they are good enough for an artificer.  I'd argue artificers applying infusions make better use of the armor regardless of who is wearing it, though.Less weapon proficiencies won't matter because subclasses either add proficiencies or the artificer uses cantrips instead.  The extra attack is similar in that subclasses add it for that style of character anyway.Using the fighting style to gain cantrips comes a level later, gives up the actual fighting style, and doesn't add the additional cantrips gained later or ritual casting.Infusions are not available to paladins or rangers.I would say the points given show they are different in some respects and not others, but doesn't demonstrate superiority or inferiority.Artificers are more versatile than paladins.  Paladins are better at nova (IME).Unique spells aren't more or less powerful than other spells of the same level.  That's the point of having spell levels to measure general power.  ;-)IME none of those classes are actually game breaking.  Hella useful sometimes but not actually game breaking.Challenge accepted, but I'm not sure we're disagreeing.  I think we both don't find artificers OP or weaksauce.Artificers are not OP.  They are pretty useful in all stages of the game, but more infusions at lower levels would be nice.  That feels a bit restrictive.I see you caught some of the arguments for artillerists I was going to make.  The armorer has good AC without needing to cast shield because of infusions and also has absorb elements as mentioned for tanking above with wizards.  Damage isn't stellar but the guardian armor draws attacks or protects other better than a lot of classes, and the electric blast from the infiltrator armor can be used to leverage the sharpshooter feat.All artificers also add sanctuary and web in the arsenal to help with protecting others, and armorers get a solid spell in hypnotic pattern to help.The bonus action can go to the homunculus for a ranged attack, or a feat to help, or hold off for using it on a bigger spell like bigby's hand or animate objects later.The subclass to watch out for is the alchemist because they are more resource dependent than the other 3 subclasses.  They can be effective but that lasting power cost for cost isn't there compared to other artificer subclasses.Yes.  Faerie fire is available to all artificers at 1st level and can cheese it later with the SSI for the homunculus to cast it and spend the concentration to maintain it.  If I want to play with more damage for the armorer that tactic plus flash of genius makes up for the hit penalty on sharp shooter more than enough.By "good" Zard means "good at damage" specifically, and when it comes up into comparison is compared to a sharpshooting crossbow expert battle master with precision.  ;-)</blockquote>

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