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<blockquote data-quote="Saeviomagy" data-source="post: 7286645" data-attributes="member: 5890">&quot;How my group plays it&quot; != &quot;what the rules say&quot;In other words, your group has a houserule. An inadvertant one, but a houserule nonetheless.... for your group. For my group, I can't say the question has yet come up, mainly because nobody has every said &quot;hey, I should know if the save was passed or failed because of concentration&quot;. People cast a spell, I describe the obvious results.Outside of that we usually forget about concentration until someone tries to concentrate on a second spell, or is in danger of losing concentration, neither of which are likely to occur for spells with subtle effects.Simply put, it's not come up.Maybe your group is different and you have some sort of marker to show that people are concentrating. Or you've had to explicitly tell someone their concentration is no longer necessary for some reason.No, it's not. It's a rule mistake. You might decide that it's worth keeping, but it's still a mistake.Given that I've not actually had a situation where a definitive ruling on this has come up... count me out of your 'everyone'. I would suspect that a great many people are in the same boat. Were this to have come up in game with suggestion or charm person, then I probably would have ruled the deception to be possible on the spot, based on prior editions where the concentration mechanic did not exist.So from my point of view, this interpretation validates some 20 years of D&amp;D for my group.That's neither here nor there though. The idea that &quot;we've been playing the rules way X for a long time&quot; changes what the rules actually are is farcical.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Saeviomagy, post: 7286645, member: 5890"] "How my group plays it" != "what the rules say" In other words, your group has a houserule. An inadvertant one, but a houserule nonetheless. ... for your group. For my group, I can't say the question has yet come up, mainly because nobody has every said "hey, I should know if the save was passed or failed because of concentration". People cast a spell, I describe the obvious results. Outside of that we usually forget about concentration until someone tries to concentrate on a second spell, or is in danger of losing concentration, neither of which are likely to occur for spells with subtle effects. Simply put, it's not come up. Maybe your group is different and you have some sort of marker to show that people are concentrating. Or you've had to explicitly tell someone their concentration is no longer necessary for some reason. No, it's not. It's a rule mistake. You might decide that it's worth keeping, but it's still a mistake. Given that I've not actually had a situation where a definitive ruling on this has come up... count me out of your 'everyone'. I would suspect that a great many people are in the same boat. Were this to have come up in game with suggestion or charm person, then I probably would have ruled the deception to be possible on the spot, based on prior editions where the concentration mechanic did not exist. So from my point of view, this interpretation validates some 20 years of D&D for my group. That's neither here nor there though. The idea that "we've been playing the rules way X for a long time" changes what the rules actually are is farcical. [/QUOTE]

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