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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Umbran" data-source="post: 5320822" data-attributes="member: 177">Well, I'll just have to say that on this point, we fundamentally disagree.  Any producer of content wants people to buy that content, sure.  But, "FORCE" (in all-caps, even)?  I just don't see it.  I expect that there's any number of quotes from books I could find to poke holes in your position, but that isn't the point of this thread.  So, I'll agree to disagree, and leave it at that.If you are a new player, how do you know what the rules are?It is my understanding and experience that new gamers are typically brought in via an apprenticeship model, not a book-learning model. Someone brings you into a game, explains the basics, and you play for a bit, and then if it seems cool you buy a book.So, your first and foremost source of information about how to play is not the book, but other people.  This is supported, at least anecdotally, by how so many here have described how they played 1e - how many mechanics and things in the rulebook they didn't use, and didnt' realize they didn't use!  That smacks less of "reading the rulebook in detail" and a lot more of "learned through oral tradition, and use the rulebooks as a reference".Me, I have a group of people playing Deadlands - I know that I, and one player, has actually read the player's book cover to cover.   He and I are the only ones that own the player's rulebook, though it is available as PDF.  So, if I want the players to learn anything abou tthe system, I have to teach it to them.  I'm cool with that.If I want them to learn about interacting with each other, I'm cool with teaching them that, too.It seems to me that every class tells you, "what it's supposed to be about", if you read the flavor text.  Or at least it tells you about as deeply as you can before running aground on the local variations - since some tables don't treat classes as in-game concepts, it gets kind of difficult to talk about them so.  You could, I suppose list some common variations, but I bet the page count is higher than you expect, and would be daunting to a new player.Yep, all valuable stuff, I agree.  I have never said there isn't a boatload of valuable information.  I have only questioned whether having a separate book for players to read it in would be particularly effective.Honest question: how much reading do you expect players to do before they attempt to play?  How much of that are they going to really absorb before they try?While there's a whole lot of potentially valuable information out there, a tome trying to impart it to a new player is, I expect, a non-starter.  A new player is not invested in the game enough to wade through multiple essays worth of material for which they lack any context for application.I expect your target is not the really new player, but someone who has played enough to get hooked, awash with enthusiasm - this person is invested enough to spend time, and has some context for understanding.</blockquote>

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