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Message: <blockquote data-quote="KarinsDad" data-source="post: 18154" data-attributes="member: 2011">I didn't miss that point. I said "GMW can be cast at short range on more types of weapons."Well, ok. Let's do a more exacting comparison.Although most wooden weapons do "lousy damage", there is no reason to increase the damage of them by +10.That really is ludicrous. A "Spiked" club does 1D6+10 x3 max. A "GMW" longsword does 1d8+5 19/20 x2 max.The increased threat range of Spikes does not bring simple wooden weapons up into martial weapons range. But, for things like a Greatclub, it brings it into reach of other large martial weapons.Plus, you are forgetting one major thing.Spikes is 3rd level whereas GMW is 4th level.GMW SHOULD be more potent, but as written Spikes is a lot more potent. Using the 1 per 2 level max 5 for damage brings Spikes into it's own. Yes, Spikes can only be used on wooden weapons. But, GMW should get something for being a 4th level spell.So, considering that GMW can be used on all weapons, let's add one point of damage to GMW weapons in our comparison due to a character using a longsword (d8) instead of a club (d6) with the +1 per 2 levels max 10 house rule. In other words, 7th level GMW does +2/+2 plus 1 more point of damage since a longsword averages a point more of damage than a club (the threat ranges are equal due to increased threat range of Spikes).5 Spikes +2/+2 6 Spikes +2/+3 7 Spikes +2/+3 7 GMW +2/+3 8 Spikes +2/+4 8 GMW +2/+3 9 Spikes +2/+4 9 GMW +3/+4 10 Spikes +2/+5 10 GMW +3/+4 12 Spikes +2/+6 12 GMW +4/+5 14 Spikes +2/+7 14 GMW +4/+515 Spikes +2/+7 15 GMW +5/+6 16 Spikes +2/+8 16 GMW +5/+618 Spikes +2/+9 18 GMW +5/+6 20 Spikes +2/+10 20 GMW +5/+6 At 5th and 6th level, Spikes is a lot better due to a Cleric not being able to use GMW at all. It is slightly better at levels 8 and 20.GMW is better at level 15 and slightly better at levels 9, 12, 13, 16 and 17.So with this house rule, GMW is slightly better overall due to being able to be used on more types of weapons. But again, it IS a fourth level spell.But, I do not think this is totally balanced as a house rule for one very important reason, even though it makes Spikes as effective as GMW for the most part.At high levels, a Druid will already have a +4 or +5 club. So, a high level Druid will be able to increase the weapon damage of that club by +5 or +6 with a 3rd level spell (assuming that the DM rules that the damage add is an enhancement bonus).The high level Cleric will be able to increase the weapon damage of his +4 or +5 Morningstar by +0 or +1 with a 4th level spell.So, the 3rd level spell at the higher levels is considerable more useful. Hmmmm.To me, this is still slightly unbalanced. I have no problem with GMW adding a lot more to a random non-magical weapon (+5/+5) in comparison to Spikes adding less to a random non-magical club (+2/+5). Why? Because you can add +5 damage to the club at level 10 whereas you have to wait until level 15 to do that with GMW. And with Brambles, you can add this mega-damage with a 2nd level spell.And finally, when you add in other spells at higher level such as Fade's mention of Ironwood, the Druid is still raking out more with a +10 add to damage.So, although Power_Munchkin's house rule is a LOT more balanced than the original wording of the spell, there is a specific REASON that the DMG limits damage for weapons to +5. JMO.</blockquote>

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