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Message: <blockquote data-quote="fenzer" data-source="post: 1409089" data-attributes="member: 506">DanMcS, I have a copy of Dead from Above and have used the dogfight rules.  I like them alot.  I was the one who recommended them to Ledded.EDIT:  Okay, I slaughted the rules so badly I needed to edit the post.  I will try to be specific here without getting into trouble with copyright issues.  I have the book in front of me.They created a Pilot class.  Good Ref save and average BAB, bonus feat every 5 levels.  They have a number of fun feats to boost piloting performance.Air combat is very simple.  There are no grids, battle mats or minis, unless you have to have them, Ledded.   <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f600.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":D" title="Big grin    :D"  data-smilie="8"data-shortname=":D" /> Everything boils down to position.  Positions is a scale ranging from 0 to 10, 10 being best.  At the start of combat all involved are at position 5.  Everyone makes a tactics check, the lowest stays at 5.  You can adjust your starting position upward by 1 for every 5 points by which you beat the others players initiative.The base position cost to make an attack is 5.  This is modified by the type of attack you wish to make, close range, long range, short burst, long burst, etc.  Total up the cost of the attack and subtract from it the difference in position between the target and the attacker.  This is the net cost of the attack.  When finished with your attack, adjust your position downward to reflect its net cost. To improve your position you make a Pilot level chech vs a DC of 10 + your current possition.  For every 5 points you are over the DC you add 1 to your possition.  If your DC where 15 and you rolled a 20, you would improve your position by 2, 1 for making the DC and 1 for beating it by 5.  If you do not make the DC, you possition does not change.The DC to hit an aircraft is its AC plus the Pilot class level of the pilot.  The attack roll is modified by range, the number of weapons being fired and the type of burst (short or long).  With a succesful hit you roll hit location.  Each location, engine, cockpit, fuselage, wing, has an armor value which works just like damage reduction in D&D.  Some weapons have a Penetration Value (PV) that can bypass this armor, the 20mm cannon for example. Bombers in formation are at position 5.  All gunners are considered to have a readied attack and my shoot at the fighter, before the fighter may shoot, but at the range from which the fighter is going to make its attack.  The gunner uses his BAB to make the attack modified by range.They put together a fun critical hit table for aircraft.  You roll d% and consult the chart, broken down by hit location, and apply modifiers.  These usually effect position. They cover bail out, parachuting, crash landings, etc.I highly recomend picking up a copy.  The only issue, you need the core rule book Weird War II: Blood on the Rhine for the weapon data and info.  None of that is included in Dead from Above.  Personally, I like what Pinnacle has done here.  They could have gone nuts and made something slow and plodding.  Instead, they created a very fluid dymanic that can recreate the intensity of air combat.  Hell, my friend and I would do 1 vs 1 dog fights just for fun.  They never lasted more than a few minutes, some as long as 10 but not many.  And it was always fun to determine the outcome of the poor sap who had to bail out.I lucked out, my FLGS has their Weird War II stuff for half off.  I'm now the proud owner of all the Pinnacles Weird War II books.   <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f60e.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":cool:" title="Cool    :cool:"  data-smilie="6"data-shortname=":cool:" />  I highly recommend Dead from Above.</blockquote>

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