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<blockquote data-quote="TerraDave" data-source="post: 6061909" data-attributes="member: 22260">Interesting.As some have touched on, this is a dichotomy that goes back a long ways...and in late 1E and 2E the split-personality could seem extreme...a game about fighting monsters and taking there stuff...where we traipse about the plains having philosophical conversations with godlings (for example). Its important to note, just so its out there, that the early gamers had characters they where attached to (their names are in spells and other places) and they ran in a much more story oriented (and power gaming) style then many of their followers. They did not run &quot;by the book&quot;. (they also didn't run their RPGs like their wargames, though again you might not know it from the 1E books). And the 1E DMG talks about things like the ongoing campaign and the need for overarching themes and what now might be called story to emerge. BUT, why did 3E (and 4E and Next for that matter) go &quot;back to the dungeon&quot; after all the push for more story oriented play in the 80s and 90s? Why are old dungeon crawls still rated as the most popular adventures?The reason is that it is a style of play that works. D&amp;D is not about 1 person telling a story, nor is it (normally) a 1 on 1 game. Its about how can a group of people can do things interesting things together in a fantasy adventure context...and the DM can run the game without going crazy. The dungeon allows for a lot choice on the players part (or should), but in a way the DM can prepare for. It also allows for cooperation, especially combat. And the focus on problem solving and avoiding death and getting treasure nicely wire together the key incentive mechanisms that many many games have copied. D&amp;D mixes gambling &amp; puzzles with popular fantasy motifs and you get to play archetypes while doing it. Whats not too love!&nbsp; But some story is ok to.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="TerraDave, post: 6061909, member: 22260"] Interesting. As some have touched on, this is a dichotomy that goes back a long ways...and in late 1E and 2E the split-personality could seem extreme...a game about fighting monsters and taking there stuff...where we traipse about the plains having philosophical conversations with godlings (for example). Its important to note, just so its out there, that the early gamers had characters they where attached to (their names are in spells and other places) and they ran in a much more story oriented (and power gaming) style then many of their followers. They did not run "by the book". (they also didn't run their RPGs like their wargames, though again you might not know it from the 1E books). And the 1E DMG talks about things like the ongoing campaign and the need for overarching themes and what now might be called story to emerge. BUT, why did 3E (and 4E and Next for that matter) go "back to the dungeon" after all the push for more story oriented play in the 80s and 90s? Why are old dungeon crawls still rated as the most popular adventures? The reason is that it is a style of play that works. D&D is not about 1 person telling a story, nor is it (normally) a 1 on 1 game. Its about how can a group of people can do things interesting things together in a fantasy adventure context...and the DM can run the game without going crazy. The dungeon allows for a lot choice on the players part (or should), but in a way the DM can prepare for. It also allows for cooperation, especially combat. And the focus on problem solving and avoiding death and getting treasure nicely wire together the key incentive mechanisms that many many games have copied. D&D mixes gambling & puzzles with popular fantasy motifs and you get to play archetypes while doing it. Whats not too love! But some story is ok to. [/QUOTE]

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