Double review by me

[Khan the Warlord]

Well, I put my first "new style" review up today (GR's The Assassin's Handbook), and the first time I clicked the button to submit the review, it gave me an error message.

So, I clicked it again and then it worked, but then I discovered that it posted it twice. When I edited one of them, the other was automatically edited the same as well, so it *seems* that they're one now. Is there a way to delete one review without killing 'em both?

Thanks.

 

[Crothian]

That's a very good review, Khan.

 

[Furn_Darkside]

I agree- it was a well written review.

I think I disagree on most of your conclusions, but that is the point. heh.

As for the double reviews- someone should be able to delete just one. I don't have the power to do so, though. heh.

FD

 

[Khan the Warlord]

That's a very good review, Khan.

Originally posted by Furn_DarksideI agree- it was a well written review.

Thanks for the compliments, guys.

Originally posted by Furn_DarksideI think I disagree on most of your conclusions, but that is the point. heh.

Just curious, but what did you disagree with? I think you mean the over half dedicated to fluff thing, but this fluff was just too good, IMO.

BTW, if anyone has any suggestions for me for future reviews (as this is going to become a regular thing for me now), please feel free to offer them to me. It would be appreciated.

 

[Furn_Darkside]

Just curious, but what did you disagree with?

Ok, first, let me say I think an assassin core class is silly. If it was not for the authors, I would have never gone near it.

Languages- I had no problem with the knowing of secret languages- assassins needs to be able to get to their target, and language is a big way of doing that.

I don't think I would just allow it to be picked off the top of a player's head, but it would be an option for the assassin if their clan thought it was appropriate.

Killing Blow- I don't quite follow the idea of them being allowed to use it on undead. So they could assassinate a lich or vampire? But those creatures involve special ways to kill anyway.

Spell Casting- I agree that the implementation is a bit sketchy, but I don't see why the explanation of magic is needed. Standard d&d is a rather magical world- it makes sense the assassin as described (one of the oldest professions) is going to have its own tricks up its sleeve.

Ex-assassin: I can see the argument of killing blow not being for the good. It is a distasteful way for ending the life of someone unaware.

The PrC's- they were not designed to revolve around the core class, but be useable by other classes.

Fida'i- I don't see the issue with an arcane class picking up a divine PrC.

Spells- You are probably correct. I don't got the book around me atm.

Poison Meta Feats- I think they were poorly done- they should have added DC to the creation of the item, instead of the application of the poison. (more of my own gripe, not a disagreement with you, heh)

The Poisons- I think the fantastic poisons should outclass the non-magical ones.

But, I think the dc to create some of the dc's was really low- and one of the magical poisons had a power that did not quite click (I think it was nevermore). It was a cool idea, but not carried out well.

You final conclusion- I never considered allowing players to play the core or PrC's. They are all for the npc's for me, but I have my own rule against evil pc's.

FD

 

[Darkness]

... I think an assassin core class is silly.

Still, an assassin core class isn't sillier than a paladin core class, though, no?

 

[Furn_Darkside]

An assassin core class isn't more silly than a paladin core class, though, no?

No, because it is special to be a paladin.

Any class who takes money to kill a political figure- is an assassin.

FD

 

[Khan the Warlord]

Ok, first, let me say I think an assassin core class is silly. If it was not for the authors, I would have never gone near it.

I disagree, even with your reply to Darkness, as there is much room for a specifically-trained killer for hire.

Languages- I had no problem with the knowing of secret languages- assassins needs to be able to get to their target, and language is a big way of doing that.

I had no problem with the bonus languages, but the fact that assassin's could learn the ultra-rare Druidic language, but yet NO ONE could ever possibly learn the secret assassin sign language was just... silly, IMHO.

I don't think I would just allow it to be picked off the top of a player's head, but it would be an option for the assassin if their clan thought it was appropriate.

I agree, but this is intended for a core class at the beginning of their creation, not something you can just "learn later", of which I believe it should have been.

Killing Blow- I don't quite follow the idea of them being allowed to use it on undead. So they could assassinate a lich or vampire? But those creatures involve special ways to kill anyway.

Sorry, I think I misled you in my review. I don't necessarily believe that Killing Blow should have a chance against undead and other creatures immune to crits, but I do think there should have been alternatives available for creatures such as those, since I could easily see a lich or vampire lord being targeted for assassination.

Spell Casting- I agree that the implementation is a bit sketchy, but I don't see why the explanation of magic is needed. Standard d&d is a rather magical world- it makes sense the assassin as described (one of the oldest professions) is going to have its own tricks up its sleeve.

I'm sorry, but I'm just spoiled I guess and like explanation on how and why a class or race is allowed magical ability. Half-orcs don't have any innate magical powers and they are a standard D&D race, so your reasoning is kinda off there. Now Gnomes do have some innate spellcasting talent, but there are explanations given. Same goes with barbarians being non-magical, while bards have limited spellcasting use.

Ex-assassin: I can see the argument of killing blow not being for the good. It is a distasteful way for ending the life of someone unaware.

I believe you're looking at flat-footed meaning if the character was completely unaware of asleep. There are other situations where this could happen and a good character could get away with doing it.

Basically, it needed more explanation, or axed altogether, IMO.

The PrC's- they were not designed to revolve around the core class, but be useable by other classes.

Very true, but they are in a book comprising assassins and assassins only, so the assassin theme is obvious. It is like creating a paladin handbook and including a demon-worshipper PrC, or even a roguish PrC.

Spells- You are probably correct. I don't got the book around me atm.

I hope I am, else I will look quite silly.

The Poisons- I think the fantastic poisons should outclass the non-magical ones.

Overall, they should, but some of our best real-world poisons don't hold a candle to some of the least powered fantasy ones, so it kinda makes it silly to even include the real world versions, if one insists on doing them that way.

BTW, thanks for the comments, even though I didn't quite agree to some and made my own replies (and failed to state where I do agree for time purposes), every comment helps me for my next review.

 

[Darkness]

No, because it is special to be a paladin.

Any class who takes money to kill a political figure- is an assassin.

FD

Heh. Shouldn't something that is special be a prestige class rather than a core class?!
BTW, if paladin is okay as a core class, blackguard would be, too, no...?
(Side note: Me, I guess I'd prefer them both to be prestige classes.)

And I can see that "assassin" might be too vague for a core class in some settings - but not in all (e.g., a ninja core class for an Asian setting).
On the other hand, "assassin" isn't much more vague than "bard."
(Not to mention the ranger, which everyone and their brother has created at least half a dozen alternate versions of.
edit for clarification - Because he's underpowered and the whole two-weapon-fighting schtick is too specific for the class.)

 

[Crothian]

Heh. Shouldn't something that is special be a prestige class rather than a core class?!
BTW, if paladin is okay as a core class, blackguard would be, too, no...?
(Side note: Me, I guess I'd prefer them both to be prestige classes.)

And I can see that "assassin" might be too vague for a core class in some settings - but not in all (e.g., a ninja core class for an Asian setting).
On the other hand, "assassin" isn't much more vague than "bard."
(Not to mention the ranger, which everyone and their brother has created at least half a dozen alternate versions of.
edit for clarification - Because he's underpowered and the whole two-weapon-fighting schtick is too specific for the class.)

Vague? How much more vague can you be then Fighter? Core classes are supposed to vague, it's prestige classes that get specific.