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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Imban" data-source="post: 4583476" data-attributes="member: 29206">At least for me, it removes the utility of "Go to Hell"-type spells, something D&D sadly did to Hell itself years ago, but now finally expanded to every plane.I mean, here's the thing: if you're throwing someone at random into the Elemental Plane of Fire, or the Negative Energy Plane, or the Positive Energy Plane, it's quite clear you wish them grievous harm and the cause of their grievous harm is apparent both intuitively (burnt to a crisp in an ocean of fire / drained of all life in a dark void / exploded into rainbows and sparkles by life energy) and borne out by what the rules and setting say about these places.If you throw someone at random into Hell, it's quite clear that you wish them grievous harm (unless they're a devil, I guess) and the cause of their grievous harm is probably intuitively apparent (torn apart by a monstrosity in Hell, cast into the lake of fire, whatever) but not borne out by what the rules and setting say about Hell, which is that it's a bad place to be due to all the devils, but it's a place that's generally survivable and which high-level heroes can and should go to in order to kick ass and take names."But," you cry, "surely there are oceans of fire in both Hell and the Elemental Chaos!", and you'd be right. The thing is that once you've made these places adventuring locales instead of The Bad Place, you lose the immediate and intuitive resonance of being sent there = bad, and have to further specify that your spell is putting them in a place that causes them immediate grievous harm.And at this point, it doesn't have any more resonance with me than a spell which teleports you into the crater of the nearest volcano for a round or two.(tl;dr: It's cool to be able to say "Go to Hell" and mean it, but it only works if Hell is unequivocally bad.)Basically everything this man says in this post, I agree with. I always just read the "infinite" planes as being finite but usually immense in order to avoid nonsense with infinity. Especially with some, like the Outlands with its finitely-spaced-out (!) border towns, you had to do far too much logical twisting in order to maintain the plane's infinity, whereas declaring it to be finite was far easier.The only one of these that didn't bug me was Sigil, because it being on top of an infinitely high mountain was just a cute little "you can't get there from here" paradox. (I mean, as long as you assumed a finite amount of Rilmani lived in a finite amount of spots along a finite lower region of the mountain.)Oh yeah, 4e totally doesn't cater to kids who love acting like they're evil incarnate and 666 layers wouldn't have any resonance among the kind of people who're the target market for 4e's Tieflings and such. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /></blockquote>

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