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Dragon Bound (Disclaimer: 40 pages long, with subtle balance)
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<blockquote data-quote="IcyCool" data-source="post: 3400031" data-attributes="member: 20308"><p>But they still get them, at no cost. The delay is certainly a "drawback" to a certain extent, but to say that they don't get the same armor proficiencies as a fighter is at best misleading, and at worst untrue.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>This is not a drawback. It's the equivalent of saying "Yeah, he gets to cast spells and a fighter doesn't, and he gets a sweet list of spells to choose from, but he only gets to cast a few of them per day!"</p><p></p><p>To tell you the truth, the spell list is one of the big balance problems with the class. I can see why you want those spells in there (after all Eragon used many of them), but you are basically giving the class all the blasty doom of the wizards, and plenty of healing goodness from the clerics.</p><p></p><p>Also, under the <strong>Spells:</strong> description, you don't note how they determine their caster level. Is it equal to their Dragon Bound level, or is it like the Paladin's caster level?</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>This is not a drawback. This is a way for the character to get multiple spells off in a single round. It's like a free quicken spell.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>No, if you can cast it on other characters, that makes it useful on others. It's like a Bards cure spells. You would, in essence, be a backup healer for the group.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Yes? Once to refer to weapon proficiences, and once to refer to the super buffing weapon. If my wording was confusing, I hope this clears it up.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Yes, there are, shall I quote you?</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>That +2 bonus to Strength, Dexterity, and Wisdom is untyped (or at least, no type is listed). Are they supposed to be typed (Enhancement bonuses, for example)?</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Well, let's take a look at a 20th level Paladin's Mount, and say, the weakest dragon your 20th level Dragon Bound could have (an Old White Dragon, CR 15, which fits your chart if I understand it correctly):</p><p></p><p>[sblock=Paladin's Heavy Warhorse]</p><p>Size: Large</p><p>Hit Dice: 12D8+21 (114hp average)</p><p>60ft. Land movement speed</p><p>AC: 25 (-1 size, +2 Dex, +14 natural), touch 11, flat-footed 23</p><p>Spell Resistence: 25</p><p>Str 22, Dex 14, Con 18, Int 9, Wis 13, Cha 6</p><p>Base Attack/Grapple: +9/+21</p><p>AttacK: +16 (3 natural attacks)</p><p>Fort: +16, Ref: +10, Will: +7</p><p>2+Int mod per HD for skill points (15 skill points)</p><p>Improved Evasion, Share Spells, Empathic Link, Command other horses (as per the spell)</p><p>5 feats</p><p>(I put the two stat boosts in Con and Dex to improve HP, Fort save, Ref save, and AC)</p><p>[/sblock]</p><p></p><p>[sblock=Old White Dragon]</p><p>Size: Huge</p><p>Hit Dice: 24D12+120 (276hp average)</p><p>60ft. Land movement speed, 30ft. Burrow speed, 200ft. fly speed (poor maneuverability)</p><p>AC: 31 (-2 size, +23 natural), touch 8, flat-footed 31</p><p>Spell Resistence: 21</p><p>Str 29, Dex 10, Con 21, Int 12, Wis 13, Cha 12</p><p>Base Attack/Grapple: +24/+41</p><p>AttacK: +31 (7 natural attacks)</p><p>Fort: +19, Ref: +14, Will: +15</p><p>Breath Weapon: 8d6 cone of cold, DC 27</p><p>6+Int mod per HD for skill points (189 skill points)</p><p>9 feats</p><p>[/sblock]</p><p></p><p>The dragon is better (far superior, in fact) in just about every way. And the dragon and rider can basically share hitpoints (with a good concentration check), so the rider has just gained 270 or so ablative hitpoints.</p><p></p><p>If I am misunderstanding your chart for the Dragon Companion, please let me know.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>True, but the other half of his wealth belongs to his dragon, and between the two, they are just as equipped as the fighter (and get twice as many actions).</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>A barbarian is simply a fighter with fewer feats, and medium armor. So if your class would beat the barbarian, it would probably beat the fighter as well.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>That's because it never needs to multiclass. Healing Magic? Check. Arcane blasting Magic? Check. Utility Magic? Check. Good Base Attack Bonus? Check. So this isn't really as much of a disadvantage as you seem to think.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I don't remember the class in the Draconomicon being all that great, but it is at least a precedent. I don't think the class in the Dragonlance setting gives you a dragon, it just requires that you have one in order to enter.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Well, according to your <strong>Flight as One</strong> chart, you mention dragons of small size and smaller, and also mention the rider being mounted. You may have been mentioning them for completeness, but I thought I'd point it out to be sure.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Yes, they become a fighter with no bonus feats or heavier armor proficiences, but two good saves. My guess is that any player that lost his dragon permanently (which there currently is no way to do, since it can be raised/resurrected) would likely suicide his character (unless the player is reasonably mature). It's a bit of a glass cannon-like in that respect.</p><p></p><p>As a minor spelling quibble, you've used the word "tack" where you meant to use "take", a spell check won't find that.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="IcyCool, post: 3400031, member: 20308"] But they still get them, at no cost. The delay is certainly a "drawback" to a certain extent, but to say that they don't get the same armor proficiencies as a fighter is at best misleading, and at worst untrue. This is not a drawback. It's the equivalent of saying "Yeah, he gets to cast spells and a fighter doesn't, and he gets a sweet list of spells to choose from, but he only gets to cast a few of them per day!" To tell you the truth, the spell list is one of the big balance problems with the class. I can see why you want those spells in there (after all Eragon used many of them), but you are basically giving the class all the blasty doom of the wizards, and plenty of healing goodness from the clerics. Also, under the [b]Spells:[/b] description, you don't note how they determine their caster level. Is it equal to their Dragon Bound level, or is it like the Paladin's caster level? This is not a drawback. This is a way for the character to get multiple spells off in a single round. It's like a free quicken spell. No, if you can cast it on other characters, that makes it useful on others. It's like a Bards cure spells. You would, in essence, be a backup healer for the group. Yes? Once to refer to weapon proficiences, and once to refer to the super buffing weapon. If my wording was confusing, I hope this clears it up. Yes, there are, shall I quote you? That +2 bonus to Strength, Dexterity, and Wisdom is untyped (or at least, no type is listed). Are they supposed to be typed (Enhancement bonuses, for example)? Well, let's take a look at a 20th level Paladin's Mount, and say, the weakest dragon your 20th level Dragon Bound could have (an Old White Dragon, CR 15, which fits your chart if I understand it correctly): [sblock=Paladin's Heavy Warhorse] Size: Large Hit Dice: 12D8+21 (114hp average) 60ft. Land movement speed AC: 25 (-1 size, +2 Dex, +14 natural), touch 11, flat-footed 23 Spell Resistence: 25 Str 22, Dex 14, Con 18, Int 9, Wis 13, Cha 6 Base Attack/Grapple: +9/+21 AttacK: +16 (3 natural attacks) Fort: +16, Ref: +10, Will: +7 2+Int mod per HD for skill points (15 skill points) Improved Evasion, Share Spells, Empathic Link, Command other horses (as per the spell) 5 feats (I put the two stat boosts in Con and Dex to improve HP, Fort save, Ref save, and AC) [/sblock] [sblock=Old White Dragon] Size: Huge Hit Dice: 24D12+120 (276hp average) 60ft. Land movement speed, 30ft. Burrow speed, 200ft. fly speed (poor maneuverability) AC: 31 (-2 size, +23 natural), touch 8, flat-footed 31 Spell Resistence: 21 Str 29, Dex 10, Con 21, Int 12, Wis 13, Cha 12 Base Attack/Grapple: +24/+41 AttacK: +31 (7 natural attacks) Fort: +19, Ref: +14, Will: +15 Breath Weapon: 8d6 cone of cold, DC 27 6+Int mod per HD for skill points (189 skill points) 9 feats [/sblock] The dragon is better (far superior, in fact) in just about every way. And the dragon and rider can basically share hitpoints (with a good concentration check), so the rider has just gained 270 or so ablative hitpoints. If I am misunderstanding your chart for the Dragon Companion, please let me know. True, but the other half of his wealth belongs to his dragon, and between the two, they are just as equipped as the fighter (and get twice as many actions). A barbarian is simply a fighter with fewer feats, and medium armor. So if your class would beat the barbarian, it would probably beat the fighter as well. That's because it never needs to multiclass. Healing Magic? Check. Arcane blasting Magic? Check. Utility Magic? Check. Good Base Attack Bonus? Check. So this isn't really as much of a disadvantage as you seem to think. I don't remember the class in the Draconomicon being all that great, but it is at least a precedent. I don't think the class in the Dragonlance setting gives you a dragon, it just requires that you have one in order to enter. Well, according to your [b]Flight as One[/b] chart, you mention dragons of small size and smaller, and also mention the rider being mounted. You may have been mentioning them for completeness, but I thought I'd point it out to be sure. Yes, they become a fighter with no bonus feats or heavier armor proficiences, but two good saves. My guess is that any player that lost his dragon permanently (which there currently is no way to do, since it can be raised/resurrected) would likely suicide his character (unless the player is reasonably mature). It's a bit of a glass cannon-like in that respect. As a minor spelling quibble, you've used the word "tack" where you meant to use "take", a spell check won't find that. [/QUOTE]
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