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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Genghis Don" data-source="post: 9698081" data-attributes="member: 7037942">damn, toaster that just makes me sad, the ranger stuff...I cannot imagine no play outside dungeons, outside TSR modules (which I/we found to be almost entirely useless...all made for groups larger than we wanted to play...not that we didn't have enough players, but the game was no fun with that many at one time!). Giant class is basically all the evil humanoid races, everything from kobolds, goblins, orcs, hobgoblins, gnolls, bugbears, ogres, trolls, giants & all the various cousin later added like a flind, norker, giant 2 headed troll, and so on. Like the bulk of the "human-like shaped" baddies. Ranger HP was argued over, but with always a high con score (14+1 age minimum) 11d8 >9d10, and that massive pile of HP at L1 rocks! As mentioned, monks also start with 2 dice, d4's though, and non fighter con mods. I think the archer from dragon magazine also was 2d8 from memory, but it was rare & not seen again after AD&D/1e. I find it painful, the no tracking ever bit. But i do understand from playing online how different other groups often were on all sorts of things. Knowing Amerindian & frontier tales, and Conan, as well as Arragorn, heck even later on, Richard Cypher/Rahl...uh, yeah, so handy/cool!L10 fighter 16 con; average hp 9x7.5+3=71; max hp 9x12+3=111L10 fighter 18 con; average hp 9x9.5+3=89; max hp 9x14+3= 129L10 ranger 16 con; average hp 11x6.5=72; max hp 11x10=110L10 ranger 18 con; average hp 11x8.5= 94; max hp 11x12= 132ranger does need more xp to level up though, so fighters will get about 12 hp for every 6 a ranger does in the very high levels beyond (4 levels to 3). It's also possible a fighter doesn't have a con bonus (and not really for rangers, or very rare indeed). I think, and have thought since the 80's, the "HP gap" is illusory.</blockquote>

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