Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Rocket your D&D 5E and Level Up: Advanced 5E games into space! Alpha Star Magazine Is Launching... Right Now!
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Dragonmarked
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Graf" data-source="post: 3236995" data-attributes="member: 3087"><p>The <a href="http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=183304" target="_blank">review</a> is up.</p><p></p><p>[sblock]Lei getting kicked out or not kicked out isn't the issue for me. It's her whole life up until that point. Basically she does exactly what she's told, she goes where she's instructed, she marries the guy they pick for her, etc.</p><p>Like the young daughter of a noble family in medieval Europe she has no say in any decision of significance in her life. And it’s not her personality. Dane never says “you don’t have to do what your parents want, etc etc” because, socially, SHE DOES.</p><p>His case supports that point, he's performed terrible (but unexplained) acts on behalf of his house for the house's monetary benefit, and then leavings and never speaking to anyone from it again (as much as he can). </p><p></p><p>It's fairly clear that in KB's novels at least in your house you do what you’re told. And your House tells you what to do a lot.</p><p>He’s not Dragonmarked, btw, he’s just a member of his house.</p><p></p><p>It is some kind of weird ‘port’ of medieval life.</p><p></p><p>I take issue with this on two levels</p><p>1. It’s not good for DnD games. The roleplaying suppliments don’t imply that House members are as bound as they are in KB’s novels, but anything that he writes is going to noticed. So a player who doesn’t want to roleplay being at someone’s beck and call all the time is never going to be interested in playing Dragonmarked. And any DM who wants to include them is going to be faced with the image (set up by these novels) that it’s basically like a legal version of the mafia. You do what the godfather says or you leave and hope you never need to call on his aid again.</p><p>It makes it hard to imagine a Favored in House character who would be fun to play. Especially since some DMs tend to jerk characters around a bit. “Sure you can be some important noble, but you have to do exactly what DMNPC says or you’re in big trouble!”</p><p></p><p>2. It’s weak storytelling. It’s easy to create dramatic situations in a novel by creating a monolithic force in a character’s life and letting them get all angsty about how they’re oppressed and stuff. Except for their House relationships and a couple of adjectives (Dane is stalwart, Lei is quiet) they don’t have much depth as characters. Dane spends most of his character time emoting about how terrible the houses are. Lei spends most of her time dealing with Dane emoting and then with the fact that she’s been kicked out.</p><p>It’s not terribly interesting for the reader. If KB had spun a great story out of it I would be more forgiving about point 1. but he hasn’t. </p><p>He’s a gifted creator in general, and I expect that if he keeps writing he’ll hit his stride, but a lot of the points where he deviates from DnD (All-members-of-dragonmarked-houses-are-virtual-slaves, Pierce being immune to the mindflayer’s mindblast because he’s a Warforged, Lei’s mark giving her access to <em>disable construct</em>) don’t’ seem to do much story wise.</p><p>Obviously people like GRRM are spoiling readers of fantasy right now. But it’s hard not to think that Eberron provides holds potential for more interesting stories than are being told.[/sblock]</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Graf, post: 3236995, member: 3087"] The [url=http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=183304]review[/url] is up. [sblock]Lei getting kicked out or not kicked out isn't the issue for me. It's her whole life up until that point. Basically she does exactly what she's told, she goes where she's instructed, she marries the guy they pick for her, etc. Like the young daughter of a noble family in medieval Europe she has no say in any decision of significance in her life. And it’s not her personality. Dane never says “you don’t have to do what your parents want, etc etc” because, socially, SHE DOES. His case supports that point, he's performed terrible (but unexplained) acts on behalf of his house for the house's monetary benefit, and then leavings and never speaking to anyone from it again (as much as he can). It's fairly clear that in KB's novels at least in your house you do what you’re told. And your House tells you what to do a lot. He’s not Dragonmarked, btw, he’s just a member of his house. It is some kind of weird ‘port’ of medieval life. I take issue with this on two levels 1. It’s not good for DnD games. The roleplaying suppliments don’t imply that House members are as bound as they are in KB’s novels, but anything that he writes is going to noticed. So a player who doesn’t want to roleplay being at someone’s beck and call all the time is never going to be interested in playing Dragonmarked. And any DM who wants to include them is going to be faced with the image (set up by these novels) that it’s basically like a legal version of the mafia. You do what the godfather says or you leave and hope you never need to call on his aid again. It makes it hard to imagine a Favored in House character who would be fun to play. Especially since some DMs tend to jerk characters around a bit. “Sure you can be some important noble, but you have to do exactly what DMNPC says or you’re in big trouble!” 2. It’s weak storytelling. It’s easy to create dramatic situations in a novel by creating a monolithic force in a character’s life and letting them get all angsty about how they’re oppressed and stuff. Except for their House relationships and a couple of adjectives (Dane is stalwart, Lei is quiet) they don’t have much depth as characters. Dane spends most of his character time emoting about how terrible the houses are. Lei spends most of her time dealing with Dane emoting and then with the fact that she’s been kicked out. It’s not terribly interesting for the reader. If KB had spun a great story out of it I would be more forgiving about point 1. but he hasn’t. He’s a gifted creator in general, and I expect that if he keeps writing he’ll hit his stride, but a lot of the points where he deviates from DnD (All-members-of-dragonmarked-houses-are-virtual-slaves, Pierce being immune to the mindflayer’s mindblast because he’s a Warforged, Lei’s mark giving her access to [i]disable construct[/i]) don’t’ seem to do much story wise. Obviously people like GRRM are spoiling readers of fantasy right now. But it’s hard not to think that Eberron provides holds potential for more interesting stories than are being told.[/sblock] [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Dragonmarked
Top