Pathfinder 1E Dragons & spellcasting (3e/PF)

[S'mon]

My view:
Take pen.
Go to Dragon entry in Monster Manual/Bestiary.
See where it lists the dragon spellcaster level.
Strike that through.
Do that with every dragon.

This does a lot to solve the "dragons are super-wizards who can also eat you" problem,
and gets them behaving like dragons again. They still have plenty of dragon-specific
abilities. If you think it leaves them underpowered for their CR just boost their Spell Resistance an appropriate amount; I don't think they need any buffs to their attacks & defences. Maybe give them a saving throw boost too, or let them roll twice when making a save and take the better result.

 

[Derren]

And who decides how dragons have to behave?
D&D and also Pathfinder are very magic heavy so it only makes sense that the top predators which dragons are intended to be can cast magic.

 

[RUMBLETiGER]

From what I understand, Dragons form a foundation for Arcane magic knowledge in D&D. The Sorcerer class originates from Draconic bloodline. Wizards study Draconic as a language because it's where arcane magic originates.

You're welcome as a DM to redesign any creature however you want, but Dragons and Arcane casting have a rich history in the game, and are tied together in my mind as much as the dragon's breath weapon and wings.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

IMO-

It is a funny chicken and the egg trick... Dragons are the biggest bad a's around but magic meant that a weak little human or elf who lives in town could take one down with a few words. SO the solution was to give dragons magic... that then turned into Dragons make the best wizards and have the best moments when casting... over time this turned Dragons from Dragons to Large tough dragon shaped Wizards...


It is a problem with the fact that Magic trumps all in D&D... as long as that is the case they have to be spell casters...

 

[gamerprinter]

A lot of folklore dragons possessed arcane powers. I don't see giving dragons magic as a solution nor a chicken before the egg thing. Folklore existed long before RPGs, and magical dragons existed as long as stories have been written about dragons. Sure some dragons were just monsters, but talking and spell casting dragons is not a recent invention.

 

[Campbell]

I'm a fan of wise dragons with mystical powers, but I am not a fan of giving them full spell casting progressions. The problem with nontrivial spell casting progressions is that they have a tendency to overwhelm all the distinctive and thematic abilities meant to breath life into a monster. Soon enough you have a bunch of wizards in funny suits with no real underlying themes and puts the work of encounter and monster design back on the DM's shoulders.