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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Belzbet" data-source="post: 5631806" data-attributes="member: 6678902">This makes sense and yeah the dread necro does gain many abilites that the normal lich doesnt. Some of them (such as fortification and bonuses to save against negative levels) are completely replaced by the undead traits gained at level 20 (which is why I am thinking it is some sort of progression to full lich including DR 15). They didnt want to give the necro the full undead traits and DR so they dealt it out slowly. Also a necro is usually a wizard and arguably a wizard has more offensive options than a dread necro. Undead mastery is plain awesome  and it is the main reason I like the class; if you want alot of undead minions I think dread necro with undead leadership is the way to go (right now I am currently planning a big castle in the negative energy plane ran by a 20th level dread necro. a cleric of nerull and a feral ogre vampire with levels of hexblade and the cool undead PrC from libris mortis called tomb Warden; they all have undead leadership and both the lich and the necro can cast animate dead and the rest of the enemies will be either followers cohorts or controlled undead it should be fun but it will take some planning... anyway...).   Yeah I really like the dread necro and it is awesome  that it knows ALL of its spells on its list when it reaches a high enough level top cast those spells and it can prepare spontaneously.  But to me it seem like it should gain the DR 15(at least in terms of the progression they laid out) and paralyzing touch. However the text only says it gains undead traits (and a phylactery). Also it seems weird to me to give the nerco +2 to wis, cha, and int. After all  and like you say they are different type of lichs... And it doesnt say the necro gains the template (after all it doesst get the +4 LA).    So i dont know I think I will give the NPC DR15, and the immunites to cold and elec. and paralzying touch (not the ability increase. I mean if it has the trademark lich body (whatever that is) it seems like it should have the DR and immunites, it already has the touch (if you notice charnel touch is almost exacly like the lich touch except the necro was given scabrous touch, etc to augment it...  adding paralysis seems fitting... but ill have to think about it especially since the necro can use charnel touch with spectral hand and the lich has no such ability (since the liches touch is a quasi-natural attack and there is no proviso about being able to use it with spectral hand) so I dont know maybe paralysis is overkill...</blockquote>

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