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<blockquote data-quote="ouini" data-source="post: 1513530" data-attributes="member: 3506">I completely agree. And while I also completely agree that an amazing amount of skill and finesse can be used in wielding daggers and quarterstaffs in the real world, I have no trouble with putting them in the &quot;Basic&quot; category along with clubs, or even slings (now *those* require more skill than a bow!), because they're common and cheap weapons a non-fighter may have plausibly practiced with growing up. Crossbows are usually in the &quot;Basic&quot; category because, moreso than bows or slings, they are point-and-shoot easy.&quot;Simple Weapons&quot; I'd likely keep the same. As for Martial Weapons, I'd shorten the list, too. Axes Picks &amp; Hammers, Bows, Flails, Swords, Clubs, Pole weapons.Bottom line: I'd offer a suggested &quot;Basic&quot; list, and suggested Martial categories, but work with any player who wanted to modify it.Right. And with ability-chains, it'd be very easy to address this problem. That is, A few of the early Bardic skills would be prerequisite for either the later Combat-Bard or Fascinate-Bard ability chains. (Just like Rage4x might be prerequisite for the continued Rage5x,6x,etc chain *and* for Greater Rage, NoFatigue Rage chain.)Conversely, there could be more than one option for a prerequisite. That is, an ability chain needn't be a single early ability-chain splitting later into several greater ability-chains. It could sometimes be that a later ability-chain (like DR) could be based on *either* of two+ earlier ability-chain prereqs.Remember, the idea is just that ability-chains are highly *conceptually* related. That's not something you can always plan for -- players can be ingeniuosly surprising in coming up with coherent concepts you hand't thought of. If one of them included having, say, Evasion (and later on, Improved Evasion), I might allow them to have the Dodge ability-chain as a prereq. *Or* I might allow high reflex as a prereq, or Fast Movement.I think the best you can plan for, is to have a solid example of a prereq for a later ability-chain, and if the player comes up with something equally good, allow it.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="ouini, post: 1513530, member: 3506"] I completely agree. And while I also completely agree that an amazing amount of skill and finesse can be used in wielding daggers and quarterstaffs in the real world, I have no trouble with putting them in the "Basic" category along with clubs, or even slings (now *those* require more skill than a bow!), because they're common and cheap weapons a non-fighter may have plausibly practiced with growing up. Crossbows are usually in the "Basic" category because, moreso than bows or slings, they are point-and-shoot easy. "Simple Weapons" I'd likely keep the same. As for Martial Weapons, I'd shorten the list, too. Axes Picks & Hammers, Bows, Flails, Swords, Clubs, Pole weapons. Bottom line: I'd offer a suggested "Basic" list, and suggested Martial categories, but work with any player who wanted to modify it. Right. And with ability-chains, it'd be very easy to address this problem. That is, A few of the early Bardic skills would be prerequisite for either the later Combat-Bard or Fascinate-Bard ability chains. (Just like Rage4x might be prerequisite for the continued Rage5x,6x,etc chain *and* for Greater Rage, NoFatigue Rage chain.) Conversely, there could be more than one option for a prerequisite. That is, an ability chain needn't be a single early ability-chain splitting later into several greater ability-chains. It could sometimes be that a later ability-chain (like DR) could be based on *either* of two+ earlier ability-chain prereqs. Remember, the idea is just that ability-chains are highly *conceptually* related. That's not something you can always plan for -- players can be ingeniuosly surprising in coming up with coherent concepts you hand't thought of. If one of them included having, say, Evasion (and later on, Improved Evasion), I might allow them to have the Dodge ability-chain as a prereq. *Or* I might allow high reflex as a prereq, or Fast Movement. I think the best you can plan for, is to have a solid example of a prereq for a later ability-chain, and if the player comes up with something equally good, allow it. [/QUOTE]

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