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Message: <blockquote data-quote="tleilaxu ii" data-source="post: 9855424" data-attributes="member: 7056413">there's separate issues here. his 'messianic' status is tautological. the fact that the criteria to be the messiah was planted in a cynical way, and that they were enacted in a cynical way either matters completely or not at all but if we're just talking about fulfilling the criteria that was laid out, then he is in fact the fremen messiah.a separate issue is his power of prescience, which seems to be something like 4-dimensional awareness - ie 'time' is a place he can look here or there at and choose from various possibilities (though ironically, knowing these possibilities robs him of 'choice' as we understand it). for such a being, stuff like means/ends, cause/effect, intention/utility, etc (which are vital moral concerns for us and other entities that can not foresee all consequences) don't apply. its hard to see how the morality of such a being would be comprehensible to others. the third issue is that from our perspective there is no way to know if someone claiming such a position is legitimate or just another murderous dictator. however, the books do seem to answer in the affirmative that he had such power, and thus the moral calculus for him is so different that we can't really meaningfully judge it.  there's a quote in the book somewhere, to paraphrase -- save us from the futures muad'dib didn't choose.</blockquote>