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<blockquote data-quote="GQuail" data-source="post: 2955626" data-attributes="member: 30709">This was a very interesting post.&nbsp; While it is, as the author admits, coloured strongly by some of personal opinions, I find the dissection of modules most interesting.In my current group, dungeon crawls are seen more as a nuisance than a joy: I specifically gave them a large, optional, non-linear Dwarven hold to choose to explore, and they set about it like a chore, so uesd were they to me railroading them through everything.&nbsp; <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":-)" title="Smile&nbsp; &nbsp; :-)"&nbsp; data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":-)" />&nbsp; I have tried to remedy this with my current dungeon by using the old &quot;get to dungeon bottom then it starts to flood&quot; trick: combined with some other obstacles, this will hopefully make the Dungeon far more memorable to them.Re: secret doors and the like: for me, at least, if I put something into the Dungeon it's to be found.&nbsp; Pregenerated dungeons which include &quot;hidden extras&quot; are one thing, and can be a bonus to paticularly lucky or smart players, but I simply will not spend an hour on designing encounters, treasures, maps etc that my players may just walk past and never get to.&nbsp; That doesn't mean I throw everything into their hands, per se: but I certainly would keep the time spent on bonus optional extras to a minimum.&nbsp; Either it's something short and sweet (like a secret treasure stash for players on the ball to subtle hints, or a hidden chamber with a mural which confirms a plot suspicion) or it's something big that I fully intend them to perhaps work out later on.An example of the latter was a dungeon I made with five floors, each of which had the same general map: but which doors were visible, locked, secret etc was different, as was the staircases.&nbsp;&nbsp; Players saw no clue on the first floor or two to the fact a whole western section was cut off: but those who got as far as level three found a door in an unexpected place, and from there found a mirroring location on the second floor.&nbsp; Getting back up to the first floor and searching for the door that matched gave them access to a chunk of the dungeon they'd missed, and with it stairwells to the lower depths.&nbsp; It wasn't guaranteed the players would work it out, of course, but it was designed to be found rather than to be an &quot;elite players only&quot; prize.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="GQuail, post: 2955626, member: 30709"] This was a very interesting post. While it is, as the author admits, coloured strongly by some of personal opinions, I find the dissection of modules most interesting. In my current group, dungeon crawls are seen more as a nuisance than a joy: I specifically gave them a large, optional, non-linear Dwarven hold to choose to explore, and they set about it like a chore, so uesd were they to me railroading them through everything. :-) I have tried to remedy this with my current dungeon by using the old "get to dungeon bottom then it starts to flood" trick: combined with some other obstacles, this will hopefully make the Dungeon far more memorable to them. Re: secret doors and the like: for me, at least, if I put something into the Dungeon it's to be found. Pregenerated dungeons which include "hidden extras" are one thing, and can be a bonus to paticularly lucky or smart players, but I simply will not spend an hour on designing encounters, treasures, maps etc that my players may just walk past and never get to. That doesn't mean I throw everything into their hands, per se: but I certainly would keep the time spent on bonus optional extras to a minimum. Either it's something short and sweet (like a secret treasure stash for players on the ball to subtle hints, or a hidden chamber with a mural which confirms a plot suspicion) or it's something big that I fully intend them to perhaps work out later on. An example of the latter was a dungeon I made with five floors, each of which had the same general map: but which doors were visible, locked, secret etc was different, as was the staircases. Players saw no clue on the first floor or two to the fact a whole western section was cut off: but those who got as far as level three found a door in an unexpected place, and from there found a mirroring location on the second floor. Getting back up to the first floor and searching for the door that matched gave them access to a chunk of the dungeon they'd missed, and with it stairwells to the lower depths. It wasn't guaranteed the players would work it out, of course, but it was designed to be found rather than to be an "elite players only" prize. [/QUOTE]

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