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<blockquote data-quote="Neonchameleon" data-source="post: 6308530" data-attributes="member: 87792"><p>Would you please stop? Your approach to RPG rules represents one tiny fraction of RPGers, and one that so far as I am aware does not have significant numbers outside The Gaming Den. This doesn't make it invalid - it just means that it is an extreme minority opinion.</p><p></p><p>Off the top of my head:</p><p>The Short Primer for Old School Games rejects the idea of rules rather than rulings. That's Matt Finch - who wrote Castles & Crusades, OSRIC v 1.0, and Swords and Wizardry. In short all those games are based on a rejection of your role of the DM. So, for that matter is Flame Princess and its refusal to have any monster manual, and <em>Vornheim</em> (the single best part of that line and a book I recommend to everyone) stands as a straight up rejection of your ideas. There is some presence in what you preach among the OSR - but it is not terribly influential there.</p><p></p><p>Despite 3.X explicitely telling the DM to overrule the rules where necessary, with Rule Zero, the largest group of online people practicing what you preach is as far as I am aware The Gaming Den and its group of 3.5 fans. Pathfinder stands as another rejection to your playstyle with all the advice given for that game.</p><p></p><p>4E, and for that matter 2E are also rejections of what you are advocating with encounter based play (a single scan of the 2E DMG should tell you this).</p><p></p><p>White Wolf/World of Darkness? The GM is straight up called The Storyteller. I have my issues with White Wolf because of this. But it's about as clear cut a rejection of what you are advocating as is possible. Indeed a big inspiration behind The Forge and Story-games is that there was too much GM authority and writing things like that - it was a rejection of exactly how far Storyteller was from your playstyle of choice.</p><p></p><p>Fate? Don't make me laugh. The GM frames scenes in Fate. And offers straight up compels.</p><p></p><p>Indeed outside the bounds of D&D I'm trying to think of a single RPG that does things the way you indicate. Possibly Harnmaster? Inside the bounds of D&D what you are advocating is a fragment within the OSR (I don't know how big because I don't know the OSR well at all) and a small fragment within the 3.5 community, obviously rejected by other 3.5 players such as Ahnehosis.</p><p></p><p>That you play the way you choose to is fine as long as you and the rest of your group has fun with it. But please stop trying to state your minority positions are "the hobby". They aren't. They are minority positions within subsets of the hobby. And there are good reasons to do things the way you indicate, so by all means keep advocating them. But there are reasons to do things in other ways and as a general rule the majority of the hobby chooses other ways. You do not get to speak for the hobby, especially not when you have beliefs so far outside the mainstream.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Neonchameleon, post: 6308530, member: 87792"] Would you please stop? Your approach to RPG rules represents one tiny fraction of RPGers, and one that so far as I am aware does not have significant numbers outside The Gaming Den. This doesn't make it invalid - it just means that it is an extreme minority opinion. Off the top of my head: The Short Primer for Old School Games rejects the idea of rules rather than rulings. That's Matt Finch - who wrote Castles & Crusades, OSRIC v 1.0, and Swords and Wizardry. In short all those games are based on a rejection of your role of the DM. So, for that matter is Flame Princess and its refusal to have any monster manual, and [I]Vornheim[/I] (the single best part of that line and a book I recommend to everyone) stands as a straight up rejection of your ideas. There is some presence in what you preach among the OSR - but it is not terribly influential there. Despite 3.X explicitely telling the DM to overrule the rules where necessary, with Rule Zero, the largest group of online people practicing what you preach is as far as I am aware The Gaming Den and its group of 3.5 fans. Pathfinder stands as another rejection to your playstyle with all the advice given for that game. 4E, and for that matter 2E are also rejections of what you are advocating with encounter based play (a single scan of the 2E DMG should tell you this). White Wolf/World of Darkness? The GM is straight up called The Storyteller. I have my issues with White Wolf because of this. But it's about as clear cut a rejection of what you are advocating as is possible. Indeed a big inspiration behind The Forge and Story-games is that there was too much GM authority and writing things like that - it was a rejection of exactly how far Storyteller was from your playstyle of choice. Fate? Don't make me laugh. The GM frames scenes in Fate. And offers straight up compels. Indeed outside the bounds of D&D I'm trying to think of a single RPG that does things the way you indicate. Possibly Harnmaster? Inside the bounds of D&D what you are advocating is a fragment within the OSR (I don't know how big because I don't know the OSR well at all) and a small fragment within the 3.5 community, obviously rejected by other 3.5 players such as Ahnehosis. That you play the way you choose to is fine as long as you and the rest of your group has fun with it. But please stop trying to state your minority positions are "the hobby". They aren't. They are minority positions within subsets of the hobby. And there are good reasons to do things the way you indicate, so by all means keep advocating them. But there are reasons to do things in other ways and as a general rule the majority of the hobby chooses other ways. You do not get to speak for the hobby, especially not when you have beliefs so far outside the mainstream. [/QUOTE]
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