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*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Dwarven Weapon Training and Superior Weapons
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<blockquote data-quote="boar" data-source="post: 4636320" data-attributes="member: 81932"><p>The argument that DWT is poorly designed because it grants "unlimited feats" is, frankly, nuts. It ignores the fact that the "extra" feats "granted" by DWT are <em>mutually exclusive.</em> At best, these "extra feats" can provide flavor (dual wielding different weapons) or avoid a minor inconvenience (you find a new DWT weapon that's better than your current one and don't have to wait for retraining). The "unlimited feats" argument is a blatant case of forming an opinion first and then searching for evidence to justify it after the fact. DWT doesn't grant extra feats the way that the human racial bonus grants an extra feat. Using language that implies it gives "extra feats" in any way is intellectually dishonest, since those feats have no functional effect on the character.</p><p></p><p>A better way to look at DWT is to consider how it affects race selection for a particular class. Let's say I'm choosing between human and dwarf for my execution axe fighter. Here are the options I'm weighing:</p><p></p><p>Human, 20 STR, WP Execution Axe: 1d12 + 5</p><p>Dwarf, 18 STR, DWT: 1d12 + 6</p><p></p><p>The dwarf has +1 damage thanks to DWT. The dwarf also gets two powerful combat abilities, better wisdom, more hitpoints, and an extra healing surge. The human gets a bonus feat (probably the amazing Action Surge) and +1 NAD, and don't forget that with his 20 STR the human is at +1 to hit. It's by no means a trivial choice.</p><p></p><p>DWT detractors are also overlooking the somewhat obvious fact that DWT <em>forces you to use axes or hammers</em>. Axes and hammers are good for damage, but some people (justifiably) prioritize accuracy over damage. The human player in the above comparison could forgo executioner axes and get WP: Fullblade instead. Now he's at +2 to hit compared to the dwarf. I'm not saying this flexibility makes the human better than the dwarf -- the dwarf does have a lot going for him -- but again, the choice is by no means trivial. Even two players who both want "the most powerful character" could choose differently. This, to me, suggests that DWT is in fact not poorly designed, and actually quite the opposite.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="boar, post: 4636320, member: 81932"] The argument that DWT is poorly designed because it grants "unlimited feats" is, frankly, nuts. It ignores the fact that the "extra" feats "granted" by DWT are [I]mutually exclusive.[/I] At best, these "extra feats" can provide flavor (dual wielding different weapons) or avoid a minor inconvenience (you find a new DWT weapon that's better than your current one and don't have to wait for retraining). The "unlimited feats" argument is a blatant case of forming an opinion first and then searching for evidence to justify it after the fact. DWT doesn't grant extra feats the way that the human racial bonus grants an extra feat. Using language that implies it gives "extra feats" in any way is intellectually dishonest, since those feats have no functional effect on the character. A better way to look at DWT is to consider how it affects race selection for a particular class. Let's say I'm choosing between human and dwarf for my execution axe fighter. Here are the options I'm weighing: Human, 20 STR, WP Execution Axe: 1d12 + 5 Dwarf, 18 STR, DWT: 1d12 + 6 The dwarf has +1 damage thanks to DWT. The dwarf also gets two powerful combat abilities, better wisdom, more hitpoints, and an extra healing surge. The human gets a bonus feat (probably the amazing Action Surge) and +1 NAD, and don't forget that with his 20 STR the human is at +1 to hit. It's by no means a trivial choice. DWT detractors are also overlooking the somewhat obvious fact that DWT [I]forces you to use axes or hammers[/I]. Axes and hammers are good for damage, but some people (justifiably) prioritize accuracy over damage. The human player in the above comparison could forgo executioner axes and get WP: Fullblade instead. Now he's at +2 to hit compared to the dwarf. I'm not saying this flexibility makes the human better than the dwarf -- the dwarf does have a lot going for him -- but again, the choice is by no means trivial. Even two players who both want "the most powerful character" could choose differently. This, to me, suggests that DWT is in fact not poorly designed, and actually quite the opposite. [/QUOTE]
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