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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Hussar" data-source="post: 3017986" data-attributes="member: 22779">Oh, true, if you want to go by total volume over time, then it does come out different.  Not hugely different, but, Tolkien does get to move up the list if you do.  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />Honestly, I do agree with Zinser in that I don't want SF themes in my game.  However, I mean it in a different way than he does.  At the root, there is a huge difference between the function of the narrative of fantasy and SF.  SF is politically motivated by and large.Warning, I'm painting with some very broad strokes here, so, don't get too excited.The basic purpose of nearly every SF story is to examine the effects of science or technology on the human condition.  Whether it's becoming a god in Dune or robots in Asimov, Data in Star Trek or the dystopian views of Heinlein; this examination of what it means to be human can be seen in so many SF stories.  Even Mary Shelly examines this nearly two centuries ago with Frankenstein.  I love these kinds of stories.  I do.  My favourite reading is probably more SF than fantasy, although I like fantasy as well.  In the wiki article, they mention the idea that modern Fantasy is an outgrowth of travel stories.  And, really, that's true.  The function of the narrative in Fantasy is generally world building.  You don't try to link it to the real world (although you can) in any sort of reflective way.  You write fantasy to create a world and present that world to the reader.  Conan wouldn't know self reflection if it bit him on the loincloth.  But Hyboria is fully realized and given an entire history.  But, that world of Hyboria isn't meant to represent anything.  It is what it is - a fantasy world.However, what makes for great reading doesn't make for a great game IMO.  I don't play RPG's to make some sort of profound statement about the human condition.  I play RPG's to kill stuff and take its lunch money.  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />  Sure, there can be stories within the game.  And hopefully they are good stories as well.  But, they are fantasy stories.  They are not meant to be anything other than what is presented - a good adventure.Trying to do that with SF, again in my opinion, doesn't work as well.  Star Wars, while clothed in SF toys, is pretty solidly fantasy in theme.  The hero farmboy travels out and slays the dragon.  There is no attempt to discuss any sort of ramifications of the technology.  It's exactly the same as magic in fantasy - it's taken completely for granted and ignored.  It works because it has to work or the story stops.  There is no attempt to link the Force to some sort of commentary on anything in the real world.That's why I say Pern is fantasy.  It's the same as Star Wars.  The science isn't the point of the story.  There's no attempt to talk about how science or technology is changing these people.  They are presented whole cloth without any conflict between themselves and their setting.  ((Well, ok, the Thread is setting, but, you know what I mean))I have no problems stealing ideas from SF and putting them into fantasy.  It's still fantasy, just with a new pair of pants and maybe a nice belt.  When you remove the idea of dealing with how science and technology affects the human condition, it's no longer SF particularly.  It's fantasy.</blockquote>

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