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Message: <blockquote data-quote="AbdulAlhazred" data-source="post: 4727095" data-attributes="member: 82106">I think elves make pretty decent Archer Rangers, but they aren't better than half-orcs or shifters. I would consider STR to be pretty key for any martial class. WIS is certainly useful to an Archer, but not decisive. There are ways to build one that work well with either race. Razorclaw Shifters are also definitely on a par with elves as Archer Rangers. The half-elf situation though really is pretty sad. They are a good scourge warlock, and stat-wise a good Dragon Sorcerer, but in neither case are they the best possible choice. It is hard to systematically assess how much dilettante helps, but given that it is handing you a weak encounter level power it generally isn't tipping the scales vs higher starting stats.  Remember the treadmill. If your primary (and in many builds secondary) stats aren't started at max and kept their for all 30 levels you are suffering an effective -1 to-hit, which is pretty much the nastiest penalty you can get. Do a thought experiment. Take your elf, dwarf, or half-elf and consider if it would be a good trade to get +1 to-hit across the board vs your racial powers (not the ability or skill benefits, everyone gets some of those). In most cases it would be better to have the +1. Then consider that if you were a race that DID have the right stat mix (the effective +1) you STILL have whatever racial powers that race gives you. They may be less good for the build than what you do have, but remember that they effectively are like a free gift!Like I said before, charop is not a blanket argument to say that races are "bad" for certain builds, it just says they are non-optimal, and when a race is ALWAYS non-optimal I think it is kind of a bummer. And I still want to know what WotC has against classic races? They are ALL uniformly non-optimal with only 2 marginal exceptions.</blockquote>

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