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<blockquote data-quote="Stone Dog" data-source="post: 2931232" data-attributes="member: 16705">Thanks for being patient in repeating that.&nbsp; More clarification is almost always a good thing and keeping your head about it is appreciated!I have heard very often how people are tired of the same old contrived treatment of elves based on Tolkienesque descriptions and folklore too though.&nbsp; New ways of looking at elves (Eberron's Aerenal and Valenar as well as Athasian elves leap to mind) are better than the standard fare to me while the elves of the Realms or Dragonlance just make me think &quot;this again?&quot;&nbsp; No, they really aren't.&nbsp; I'm serious about that, computers were a progression through stages of simple clockwork to vacuum tube monsters to mainframes to desktops all through human ingenuity and progress.&nbsp; Warforged were found in an arcane design in a faraway land by inhuman minds and a handful of humans mucked about with them for a while with not much clue what they were really doing.If computers were made from technology found in an ancient alien crash site, sold to nations all over the world and became independantly intelligent creatures capable of full emotions all in the space of two to three generations then the parallel would be alot closer.Where a warforged can use tactics, teamwork, tools and traps.&nbsp; A golem as a 0 intelligence score and can't talk.&nbsp; Can you get it to scout?&nbsp; React to body language for defense or even give an alert while standing watch?&nbsp; Teach it new tricks?&nbsp; Can it effectively take new territory and hold it?I am not saying that a golem or a warforged titan isn't a good investment here, but really I would rather have CR 13 worth of warforged soldiers, scouts and artificers rather than CR 13 worth of one tank.&nbsp; That is all the golem is.&nbsp; A tank.&nbsp; It needs a commander almost constantly and is only good for hitting things really hard.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Stone Dog, post: 2931232, member: 16705"] Thanks for being patient in repeating that. More clarification is almost always a good thing and keeping your head about it is appreciated! I have heard very often how people are tired of the same old contrived treatment of elves based on Tolkienesque descriptions and folklore too though. New ways of looking at elves (Eberron's Aerenal and Valenar as well as Athasian elves leap to mind) are better than the standard fare to me while the elves of the Realms or Dragonlance just make me think "this again?" No, they really aren't. I'm serious about that, computers were a progression through stages of simple clockwork to vacuum tube monsters to mainframes to desktops all through human ingenuity and progress. Warforged were found in an arcane design in a faraway land by inhuman minds and a handful of humans mucked about with them for a while with not much clue what they were really doing. If computers were made from technology found in an ancient alien crash site, sold to nations all over the world and became independantly intelligent creatures capable of full emotions all in the space of two to three generations then the parallel would be alot closer. Where a warforged can use tactics, teamwork, tools and traps. A golem as a 0 intelligence score and can't talk. Can you get it to scout? React to body language for defense or even give an alert while standing watch? Teach it new tricks? Can it effectively take new territory and hold it? I am not saying that a golem or a warforged titan isn't a good investment here, but really I would rather have CR 13 worth of warforged soldiers, scouts and artificers rather than CR 13 worth of one tank. That is all the golem is. A tank. It needs a commander almost constantly and is only good for hitting things really hard. [/QUOTE]

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