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Message: <blockquote data-quote="satori01" data-source="post: 881917" data-attributes="member: 7859">Part of the problem of comparing ECL issues is made extremely difficult by frankly the base races.  Dwarves and Halflings receive a lot of bonuses,(+1 saves, +1 hit thrown weapons great skill bonus/ poison and magic save bonuses racial  darkvision) that I believe when added to another race would lead people to claim that it would be a higher ECL.Unbalanced stat bonuses to my mind do not always have to necesitate an automatic ECL adjustment.  I am not sure a Hobgoblin at an ECL 0 would be any more powerful than a Dwarf.At ECL +1 I believe the Hobgoblin is at a definite disadvantage.(Please dont take this to mean that obviously unbalanced stats are ok by me, frankly +2/+2 and a minor skill bump +darkvision is the high end of "balanced")The Native Outsider is the crux of the ECL bump for the planetouched races.  All of them are pretty balanced to play if you removed the outsider tag and let them operate as normal people.Frankly almost anyone would rather advance as an outsider than as a character class, hmm 8 hd and 8 skill points a level.  Native Outsider is a "fish out of water" catergory and I think really muddles the field,(holy mixed metaphors batman!).Concerning the feats in Races of Fareun having to be rebalanced for any lowering of ECL I couldnt disagree more.  First off the idea of designing good feats to address the poor design of crappy ECL races is a sickening concept to me.  Hmm this race is gimped so lets give him a Death Blow feat in an optional product to comensate.  BLeh!  If this was truly the designers intent than the employees of WOTC should be marched in the fields and shot with high caliber rifles,(farcical statement(tm)).The feats are fine as are for any level imho, as they are limited in scope,(ie only particular races can take them), and one spends feats exploring one's hertiage that could be spent on nifty things like magic item creation, metamagic, combat feat etc.  The cool factor outweighs any powergame factor, again imho.</blockquote>

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