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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Tzarevitch" data-source="post: 2421924" data-attributes="member: 1792">I have played quite a few creatues with ECL and in answer to your question about whether or not the ECL is worth it, the answer is that it depends on what race and what classes you are using. I have played in a number of high-level campaigns to date where Level adjudtment races have ruled the roost and here is what I have learned:First of all, there are effectively two types of ECL races: Those with just Level Adjustment and those with LA and HD. Creatures with AL alone rarely have LA  higher than +2. These can be easy to stomach because 1-2 levels can be a worthwhile trade off in return for some significant ability that the creature grants. LA and HD races can be much more problematic. They really only work for classes where you don't need to have too many levels of the class to do your job because they don't advance ANYTHING but BAB, Saves and some skills.  These  really are unusable for spellcasters because you can't usually afford to give up that much casting level and still be a serious spellcaster. To expand, there are also two categories of classes with regard to LA and HD: Classes that don't require much other than BAB, HP, skills, feats and saves, and those that do. Fighter for example, fits into the former category. All it really has is BAB, Feats, d10 HD and lousy skill selection. Spellcasters, monks and rogues fit into the latter category.Fighters benefit a lot from ECL races and can even affort to take ones with HD because the boosts to STR and CON for playing a half-ogre for example can partially make up for the lost HD. Bugbears also work well as fighters because you only loose 1 level to LA. Their 3d8HD is not that different from 3d10 expecially when you add their improved CON. Also, the Bugbear's base saves are the same as the fighter's AND they get a better range of skills, +4 natural armor, +4 bonus to move silently, darkvision, +4Str and +2dex in addition +2Con. You do loose 1 BAB from the LA level and 1 more from the Humanoid HD, but the +4 Str fills the gap and increases your damage output as well.In summary, over a normal human fighter of same ECL and same base attributes a bugbear fighter of same total levels has the same hit chance, greater damage, much higher AC and better skills. Your defecits include a bit fewer HP (this becomes less of a problem at higher level when the bugbear takes fighter levels too), fewer feats, weak Cha (oh darn!) and poorer will and reflex saves (partially mitigated by higher Dex). Other fighter-type classes also benefit from LA races (Barbarian and ranger particularly). Races that grant immunities, SR, additional movement modes or useful spell-like abilities are also quite worth it for fighter-types to take, even at the cost of a couple of LA or HD because they add capabilities that those classes don't normally get. ECL and HD are not nearly as kind to spellcasters or classes which have abilities that increase only with class levels or have special skill sets (monks, rogues etc). These classes can afford an ECL or 2 but rarely more than that unless the race has an ability that is VERY useful because they simply loose too much from their classes and gain not enough in return from their race. Tzarevitch</blockquote>

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